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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | John Reformed | 61283 | ||
Dear Sir Pent, As as sweet as consensus sounds to me (especially after umpteen posting) with an audible sigh I must alas, disagree with your conclusion. This will no doubt shock no one who knows me. We do agree on the immutable aspect of the nature of God. And that is no small point! We also agree that a person in power may choose not to exercise it over others and yet not lose any part of that power, personally. You concluded: I am led to conclude that IF the Arminian perspective was correct (that God created the universe in a way that allowed people to rebel, by not using His ability to control everything completely), that He would still be sovereign. If these were the only two points then you would be correct. But your points are based on assumptions that fit neatly into your particular theology ( A calvinist could do the same). But how does it get us any closer to what we all want, which is the TRUTH? I am aware of the verses that are used to prove the arminian position and have addressed many of them my self on this forum. So going over them again may not be the best use of our time. What I would really appreciate is for someone to address my question regarding 1 Cor 2:14. Unless I'm mistken, Benjamite was really the only one who addressed the verse directly and has ffollowed up on my reply! John |
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2 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | Sir Pent | 61350 | ||
Actually, I think we do agree ..................................... Dear John, I agree that consensus is a sweet thing, and is extremely rare in these discussions of Calvinism and Arminianism. Therefore, I saw this specific topic as one area where it could be reached, and decided to try to work towards it. Thankfully, you have been able to understand where I was coming from and work from the opposite direction to get to the what seems like same place. ..................................... You said that you do not agree with my conclusion, but I fail to see where the disagreement lies. We seem to both agree that IF Arminian perspective is correct then God would still be sovereign. That is my only conclusion that I am discussing at this point. So it seems like you do agree with my conclusion. I understand that you disagree with the assumption. You do not agree that Arminian perspective is correct, but that is not the conclusion, that is the premise. And you do agree that a person who did have an Arminian perspective would still be believing in a sovereign God. Do I understand what you are saying correctly? ..................................... You also asked how this all gets us closer to the truth. I believe that most Calvinists have a misperception that Arminians do not and cannot believe in a sovereign God. Similarly, most Arminians have some misperceptions about Calvinists. Therefore, I believe that it is important for each side to gain a more accurate understanding of the other sides belief. By being able to clearly see both sides, I think that we are all much more likely to come to the real truth. ..................................... P.S. You also mentioned that you wanted people to answer your question on 1 Cor 2:14. I tried that once and you said I needed to respond to another of your former posts. I requested that you let me know which one, and never heard back from you. I assume my request just got lost in the shuffle as you’ve been so busy answering so many posts lately. It’s no problem, but if you really want me to respond to it just let me know where to find it. |
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3 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | John Reformed | 61368 | ||
Dear Sir Pent, There is no way God can be Sovereign from the Arminian perspecive! Why do I say that? 1. God is sovereign in a way that no mere creature can be described as sovereign. Your premise was based on a human person with limeted ability. He could not speak worlds into existence. He cannot even add an inch to his own height by merely saying "let me be taller"! 2. If even one atom of matter is free from God's absolute control then chaos could result. 3. Scripture (the only evidence that matters) speaks throuhout of predestination and fore ordination. I can't elaborate any further because of my work, but I just could not allow you to labor under a false impression. Due to the extrodinary length of this thread, I will post a new Question "Is God In absolute control of everything" If you wish we can take it from there. John |
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