Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | benjamite | 60659 | ||
I think I hear what you are saying. I was not always a spiritual man. At one point I was a natural man. However, if salvation is referred to in 1 Corinthians 2:14, and if a natural man never accepts the things of the Spirit of God, then no one could ever be saved. Is salvation the issue in 1 Corinthians 2:14? It seems like, from 1 Corinthians 3:1-3, that even babes in Christ won't accept the things of the Spirit of God that Paul is referring to. I think that 1 Corinthians 2 deals with the "meaty doctrines" as opposed to just "milk". |
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2 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | John Reformed | 60680 | ||
Hello Benjamite, Thank you for your reply. You said: "However, if salvation is referred to in 1 Corinthians 2:14, and if a natural man never accepts the things of the Spirit of God, then no one could ever be saved." If one believes that salvation depends upon the spiritual ability of the natural man to understand the gospel message, then you are absolutely correct! I see from your post that you disagree with the interpretation that claims that 2:14 also has implications pertaing to salvation. "...1 Corinthians 2:14? It seems like, from 1 Corinthians 3:1-3, that even babes in Christ won't accept the things of the Spirit of God that Paul is referring to. I think that 1 Corinthians 2 deals with the "meaty doctrines" as opposed to just "milk". I disagree for the following reasons: 1 Cor 3:1 "And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ." Here Paul says that he "could not speak to you as to spiritual men". Notice that he does not say that they ARE unspiritual but that, due to their immaturity (he calls them "babes"), he speaks to them AS unspiritual. Example: When I speak to my grandchild I keep my words simple and easy. I speak to him this way about things so that he may understand. 2:14, on the other hand, says: referring to the natural (unsiritual) man "he cannot understand them". 1 Cor 3:2 "I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able," Paul says:" for you were not yet able to receive it. " . In 2:14 he says the natural man does not even accept the things of the Spirit of God because to him they are foolish. As bad off as the corinthians may have been, they did not consider the things of God as foolish! 1 Cor 3:3 for you are still fleshly. For since there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not fleshly, and are you not walking like mere men? Notice again that Paul in critisizing the corinthians asks them: "and are you not walking like mere men?". He does not say they are natural (mere men) but likens their walk to that of mere men and fleshy. He is saying that their behavior and thinking resemble natural men and he is chastening them for it. Do you see my point? John |
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3 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | benjamite | 60685 | ||
I do not know how old your grandchild is, but I bet he doesn't understand Calculus. Why not? Well, there are a lot of things that come between 1,2,3... and Dx(3xy) is 3y. Now, in several years, maybe, he will be ready for Calculus, but not yet. My point is that it is more than just the words you use to talk to your grandchild, but it is also the concepts. Calculus is foolish to those who are just learning how to count. If I mention the term "hypostatic union" to a new convert, I don't think he'll have any idea what I'm talking about. Now, on the other hand, a mature believer might understand that I mean that Christ was both fully God, as if he were not Man, and fully Man, as if he were not God - God and Man united in one person. In the same way that you cannot expect an unbeliever to understand the meatier doctrines, you cannot expect a new convert to understand the concepts that you and I have been working on for years. If it was just a matter of having the Spirit, the Corinthians should have been ready. Scratch that, they would have been ready. Not only that, but we would be ready to the extent that there would be no need for this forum. Yes, I would go as far as saying that the meatier doctrines are foolish to new believers. There are some Biblical truths that are foolish to believers who have been saved for years. Let's take Salvation for example. There is one view of Salvation that is correct. There are many believers who look at a certain set of verses and say salvation happens in this manner. However, there are other believers who look at a different set of verses and say salvation happens in a different manner, and that the first group cannot possibly be right. There is one truth, where all the verses pertaining to salvation fit together perfectly.However, until we reach glory, I can very easily see how we might view the Biblical truth as foolish. |
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4 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | John Reformed | 60692 | ||
Dear Benjamite, Please observe the context in which 2:14 appears. 1 Cor 2:7-13 "but we speak God's wisdom in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages to our glory; the wisdom which none of the rulers of this age has understood; for if they had understood it they would not have crucified the Lord of glory but just as it is written, THINGS WHICH EYE HAS NOT SEEN AND EAR HAS NOT HEARD, AND which HAVE NOT ENTERED THE HEART OF MAN, ALL THAT GOD HAS PREPARED FOR THOSE WHO LOVE HIM." For to US (my caps) God revealed them through the Spirit; for the Spirit searches all things, even the depths of God. For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so the thoughts of God no one knows except the Spirit of God. Now WE (my caps) have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that WE may know the things freely given to US by God, which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words" Based on what he said in v's 7-13 Paul conludes: "But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, BECAUSE they are spiritually appraised. But HE WHO IS spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one. For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, THAT HE WILL INSTRUCT HIM? But we have the mind of Christ." (1 Cor 2: 14-16) I don't know how much plainer it can be. Paul is definitely speaking about natural man being totally incapable of understanding spiritual things for the simple reason that his spirit is the spirit o the world but believers have the Spirit of God that has endowed us with the mind of Christ. Even baby believers. John |
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5 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | benjamite | 61280 | ||
Okay, so if that is all it takes, then Paul should have been able to talk to the Corinthians as Spiritual men. Yet Paul's context goes beyond the chapter divisions, for he says, "And (continuing the thought) I, brethren, could not speak to you (the believing, but still fleshly Corinthians) as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ." (3:1) (parenthetical thoughts are mine) The problem in Corinth was that the baby believers could not handle the solid food. Yes, they have the Spirit of God, but they were still fleshly. (3:2-3) The problem is that it is more than just whether one has the Spirit or not. |
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6 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | John Reformed | 61287 | ||
Hi Benjamite, It's good to hear from you. I was just posting Sir Pent and telling him that you are probably the only one whohas stayed on the verse itself. I don't mean to say that other related verses should not be used to cast additional light on v.14 for you and I have done that very thing. The problem lies in when we get so far afield of the verse itself, it can be forgotten entirely. You said: "The problem in Corinth was that the baby believers could not handle the solid food. Yes, they have the Spirit of God, but they were still fleshly. (3:2-3) The problem is that it is more than just whether one has the Spirit or not." Do you believe that is possible to be a natural man and a spiritual man at one in the same time? Or do you believe that spiritual man simply acts as if he is a natural at times? John |
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7 | How can anyone be saved? | 1 Cor 2:14 | benjamite | 61694 | ||
A natural man seems to me to be one who does not have the spirit. A spiritual man seems to me to be one who is living by the Spirit. However, it seems like there is some sort of a "mix" - believers who still act like unbelievers. So with that admitted, I guess the question is, "Do 3:1ff and 2:14 refer to the same group?" I need to work on that. |
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