Results 1 - 6 of 6
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | Robert Nicholson | 66012 | ||
Dear brother Tim: Please forgive me for butting in. I would value your response to a statement I made today on this topic: This question about our Lord Jesus Christ has been viewed from many angles, some from the scripture while others from our imagination. What does the scriptures say? In the old testament scriptures God speaks about his Son after death "For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell(hades); neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption" ( Psalm 16:10) Where is hades or What is hades? Strong's word "hades" # 86 refers to the place of departed Spirits after their physical death. A later use speaks of the grave. We know that when Jesus died he went to Paradise and his body was put in Josephs new tomb. Peter reminds us of this "He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell(hades), neither did his flesh see corruption. (Acts 2:31) Our Lord Jesus Christ also spoke of "hades" in Luke 16: 19-31 He shows it to be the place of departed spirits and that it is divided into 2 sections, one man was in torment while the other was comforted in Abraham's bosum. Jesus made it clear that between the two their was a great divide, in other words our eternal destiny is determined before we die. On the cross with confidence the Lord Jesus Christ said to the dying thief "Today shalt thou be with me in paradise" (Luke 23:43) Jesus knew exactly where he was going after death. People have been asking "did Jesus suffer in hell (hades)after his death"? The scriptures only speak of the suffering of Christ upon the cross, first at the hands of men and secondly and more terribly at the hands of God when he was made sin for us. (Isaiah53:5) When those dark hours of suffering were over Jesus spoke with a loud voice a very important statement "It is Finished!"(John 19:30) What did he mean? He meant that the work on the cross was Complete! Never again would he suffer for sin because on the cross he satisfied the holy claims of God against sin. It is also noteworthy and important to note that when the work was finished our Saviour commended himself to God and dismissed his own spirit. (Luke23:46) It was an act of rest for Jesus as his spirit went to the comfort of paradise. We know that his body was placed in the tomb and that it never saw corruption because of his perfections. After 3 days he is resurrected from the dead, fourty days later he is taken up into heaven and is seated at the right hand of God. (Heb. 1:3) Where is paradise know? Christians today in this age are absent from the body and present with the Lord(2Cor. 5:8) Paul speaks of being caught up into the third heaven or being caught up into paradise. (1Cor. 12:2-4 What about the souls of Abraham who were at comfort in Abraham's bosom? It has been suggested that Ephesians 4:8-10 refers to Christ as he ascends on high he takes the souls of the redeemed with him and that they are now present with the Lord. "Never more shall God, Jehovah Smite the Shepherd with the sword; Never again shall cruel sinners Set at nought our glorious Lord! Praise his worthy name! Robert |
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2 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | Morant61 | 66019 | ||
Greetings Robert! You are more than welcome to butt in! I do it all the time! ;-) Excellent post my friend! One of the problems with the doctrine that says Christ went to Hell is that the words for 'grave', 'paradise', and 'hell' have been very sloppily handled. As you point out, Christ's body went into the grave for 3 days. He went to paradise and preached to the prisoners. However, no Scripture ever says that Jesus went to Hell. Hell, as we commonly think of it, is empty right now except for certain fallen angels. It will not be occupied until after the judgement. Then, and only then, will the lost be sent to Hell - along with Satan and his minions. Well, I've have to get to bed. Thanks for the contribution. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | Where do they go | Luke 23:46 | mbooker | 66030 | ||
Good morning Brother Tim I read where you said 'Hell, as we commonly think of it, is empty right now except for certain fallen angels'. I thought that the lost went to 'Hell, as we commonly think of it' :) when they died. I drew this conclusion from: And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. Luke 16:20-31 I do understand that Jesus taught in parables. If unbelievers don't go to ''Hell, as we commonly think of it' :) when they die, where do they go? It's nice to be able to dialouge with you again... :) Meredith |
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4 | Where do they go | Luke 23:46 | Morant61 | 66034 | ||
Greetings Meredith! Long time, no see my friend! :-) Allow me to explain my point, but first let me emphasis that I do believe in an eternal punishment in Hell for the wicked. The only problem is that the KJV (along with several other translations) translates four different words as 'hell'. This leads to much confusion over who is in hell, when, why, ect... Here are the four different words: In Hebrew (Sheol) and in Greek (Hades, Tartarus, and Gehenna). Allow me to briefly describe each term. 1) Sheol: Hebrew only uses one word to describe the state of the dead. This word can simply refer to death or the grave in general or it can refer to the spiritual status of all the dead. Prov. 9:18 says of Sheol - "But little do they know that the dead are there, that her guests are in the depths of the grave." Thus, Sheol is a place where all the dead go. Ps. 9:17 says that Sheol is a place where the wicked go - "The wicked return to the grave, all the nations that forget God." However, even godly Jacob expected to go to Sheol according to Gen. 44:29 - " If you take this one from me too and harm comes to him, you will bring my gray head down to the grave in misery.?" And, Ps. 89:48 affirms that all men will go to Sheol - "What man can live and not see death, or save himself from the power of the grave? Selah" Thus, this Old Testament word is best translated as 'Death' or the 'Grave' and simply refers to the state of all men at death. It does not refer to what we think of as 'Hell' in the sense of an eternal place of conscience punisment. 2) Hades: This is the New Testament equivalent of Sheol. It has much the same meaning as did Sheol with one exception. That exception being that the New Testament fills the meaning out with the passage to which you refered. Thus, we discover in Luke 16:20-31 that there are compartments in Sheol/Hades. There is a place of punishment where the wicked go to await final judgement and there is a paradise side, Abraham's bosom, where the righteous go to await salvation. This paradise side is now empty. After the death of Christ, complete atonement was made for sin and all those who died 'in Christ' went to be with Him in Heaven. Notice that Jesus did not tell the thief on the cross that he would be with Him in Heaven today, becase Heaven was not available until after the resurrection of Christ. The wicked dead still go to the punishment side of Sheol/Hades and will remain there until the Great White Throne of Judgement. 3) Tartarus: This word is only found once in the Bible. 2 Peter 2:4 desribes it as a place where certain Angels were placed until judgement. Some believe that it may be a lower part of Sheol/Hades. 4) Gehenna: This word describes what we commonly think of as Hell. It is used 12 times in the New Testament and describes a place of punishment, fire, and condemnation. I believe that Gehenna is also refered to in Rev. 20:11-15, where it is called a 'lake of fire'. However, note that this passage teaches that those in Sheol/Hades will be judged and then place into the 'lake of fire'. Thus, no one is actually in Hell right now! This is part of the reason why it is unBiblical to say that Jesus descended into Hell after His death. He went into Sheol/Hades (or the Grave), where Scripture foretold that God the Father would not leave Him. He went to paradise (possibly the prison of 1 Peter 3:9), but there is not any Scripture which says that He went to Hell. Nor, did He need to go to Hell to suffer and complete our salvation as many in the WOF camp teach. Our salvation was fully accomplished upon the cross and on the cross alone. I hope this answers your question and clarifies my point! :-) Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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5 | Where do they go | Luke 23:46 | mbooker | 66037 | ||
Thanks so much for your response Brother Tim!! You were clear and I was able to follow you. The reason your statement prompted me to ask my question was because it (your statement) sounded similiar to what a Jehovah's Witness said to me once. She said that the dead are asleep and I could not reconcile that with Luke 16:20-31. I understand what you are saying. The wicked dead go to Sheol/Hades to await judgement. Now, my question is :) Are those who are presently in the punishment side of Sheol/Hades 1. 'in torments' (v23) and 2. 'tormented in this flame' (v24) as the rich man was? That's what I am trying to understand. If the wicked dead are in a peaceful sleep or are they in torment in Sheol/Hades. thanks again for your time Meredith |
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6 | Where do they go | Luke 23:46 | Morant61 | 66045 | ||
Greetings Meredith! Though most of the descriptions of torment are related to the final state of the wicked (i.e. - Gehenna), the passage you quoted from Luke makes it clear that the wicked are both in torment and conscience. Unfortunately, they have no hope of salvation or reprieve. :-( Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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