Results 1 - 3 of 3
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | Morant61 | 65312 | ||
Greetings Pastor Glenn! I haven't read all of the posts on this subject, but if I may interject a point! You seem to be reading Mark 9:38-41 as a treatment of how to deal with falst ministries. Yet, the passage nowhere says that these individuals were false, only that they were not of the twelve. The meaning of the passage is quite clear, that those who are not against us are with us. However, other passages of Scripture do list what we should do in the case of false teachers. For instance, 2 John 10-11 says, "If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. 11 Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work." Romans 16:17-18 says, " I urge you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them. 18 For such people are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the minds of naive people." 1 Cor. 5:11 says, "But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat." Titus 3:10 says, "Warn a divisive person once, and then warn him a second time. After that, have nothing to do with him." So, Scripture is clear about how we should deal with those whose teachings and/or lives do not match up to the Gospel. However, Mark 9:38-41 does not address such a case. It does not deal with a false teacher or a false prophet. It dealt with someone who was working miracles in the name of Christ, but who was not one of the twelve. The disciples thought that he was doing something wrong, since he was acting in the name of Christ. Christ made it clear that he was not doing anything wrong. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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2 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | Pastor Glenn | 65319 | ||
Brother Moran, You said, "You seem to be reading Mark 9:38-41 as a treatment of how to deal with falst ministries. Yet, the passage nowhere says that these individuals were false, only that they were not of the twelve. The meaning of the passage is quite clear, that those who are not against us are with us. " No, I am not reading this scripture as a treatment of how to deal with false ministries. I am looking at it the way Christ meant for it to be used, that is to determine whether or not a ministry is false. So yes, the meaning of the passage is quite clear, that those who are not against us are with us. 2 John 1:7 For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. 8Look to yourselves, that we do not lose those things we worked for, but that we may receive a full reward. 9Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 10If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him; 11for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds. Notice: 7"...who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh..." The point being made in this scripture has to do with the deity of Christ. All I am saying is that we need to deal with the heart of the issue. If WOF teachers all were to agree that it is wrong to impose their will "above God's will". And if they were all to say that words are not "containers" that give us magical powers. And if all other false teaching is rejected, is faith healing still allowed? Is faith in God to bring us through our problems allowed? Should we still have faith in God for anything else besides for salvation through Christ? Gracefull was saying that she did not "see" the false teachings that were being alledged. So why is this lynch mob gathered around. Pastor Glenn |
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3 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | Morant61 | 65325 | ||
Greetings Pastor Glenn! I hope that I am not part of a 'lynch mob'! :-) The Scripture to which I refered earlier all dealt with various problems. Some, like 2 John, dealt with the deity of Christ, other dealts with other false teachings, and still other dealt with ethical problems. Each needed to be addressed. However, you state that Mark 9:38-41 is how we should 'determine whether or not a ministry is false'. Where exactly does the passage say that? What exactly is the criteria? Is it the simple fact that they claim to do miracles? Is it the fact that they claim to be Christian? I really don't believe that this issue is dealt with at all in Mark 9. My friend, I have no problem at all with believing that God heals when He wills to do so. I have seen it happen. I have no problem believing that faith in God can bring us through any circumstances. However, I do have a problem with the way some define faith, as though it were some power which can be used to change reality or force God to do what we want. Allow me to share a personal story with you about this kind of faith teaching. My wife and I had a son who was born with congenital heart defects. We attended a church at the time that bought into this sort of teaching, at least many in the church did. Our son lived to be 9 months old before he went home to be with the Lord. We prayed and asked for healing, but first and foremost, we prayed that God's will would be done, not ours. Our son died. Later, my wife was told that our son died because we did not have enough faith. Faith is not a power. Faith is simply a trust in God, a trust which sees us through even the bad times. A faith which stands firm even when, like Job, one's life falls apart. This church which we attended wanted to turn God into a magic Genie who would grant their every wish. This simply isn't Biblical. God doesn't promise us that we will always be healthy, wealthy, and wise. He does promise us that He will never leave us nor forsake us. He doesn't promise us that we will not walk through the valley of the shadow of death, but He does promise us that He will be with us and comfort us. Real faith is that of those like Joni Erickson, who are able to rise above their circumstances and serve God joyfully. Real faith is that of those like Jim Elliot, who layed down his life for Christ. However, it is difficult to discuss such a broad issue like this with any detail. So, why don't you present the core teaching of the Word of Faith as you understand it, with Biblical support. Then, we can discuss that in more detail. I promise I'll leave the rope at home! :-) Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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