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NASB | Acts 8:13 Even Simon himself believed; and after being baptized, he continued on with Philip, and as he observed signs and great miracles taking place, he was constantly amazed. |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | Acts 8:13 Even Simon believed [Philip's message of salvation]; and after being baptized, he continued on with Philip, and as he watched the attesting signs and great miracles taking place, he was constantly amazed. |
Subject: How do I make sense of the context? |
Bible Note: I ask the gracious permission of "Ed the Moderator" to diverge slightly for a commercial break in order to type a paragraph without mentioning the word "Mormon." You wrote: "Joe I understand your belief on guilt and how man is helpless to do anything about it unless he is elected. Even in the face of the John 3:16 which says God so loved the world (not just the elect or the ones that would choose Him but the world) that He sent His only begotten Son that whosoever (again not just the elect) would believe in Him and have everlasting life." I respond (NOT pulling statements out of nowhere to distract as "someone" has been falsely accusing me of): http://www.thirdmill.org/files/english/html/th/TH.h.McLaughlin.LA.20.html Sorry about the link, but cut-and-paste takes up so much space, and not everyone is as fascinated by this debate (as you yourself have claimed not to be, despite your active part in continuing it). Now, back to the LDS! :) You wrote: "Explain why a newbie Mormon isn't at the place you say a man can't reach unless he is elected." "Now let's take a new Mormon. What are they seeking? I have yet to find one that hasn't said forgivenness of sin." And how many Mormons have you witnessed to? That is a pretty blanket statement you are making about the mindset of the Mormon convert. And if they are seeking true, godly repentance, then surely all of them abandon Mormonism when you witness to them, since their hearts were already pre-disposed to embracing the truth you were giving them. Right? It is very hard to make a general statement as to why someone converts to a false religion. However, we can clearly see (if we believe the gospel) that Mormons have not exhibited a repentance leading to eternal life, which is "the place I say a man can't reach unless he is elected." For at least the third time, the doctrine of radical depravity does NOT hold that humans are unaware of their own guilt and need for forgiveness. I hope you will let that sink in so that we can finally put this to rest. What the doctrine of radical depravity DOES hold is that the non-elect are morally incapable of ever exhibiting the repentance that leads to eternal life. Whatever path they choose in their "search," it will be away from true Christianity. When confronted with true Christianity, they will either reject it, or profess to embrace it while not truly repenting and believing. They simply do not want to submit to God's law; indeed, they cannot. Take it up with Paul and his letter to the Romans if that seems to be contrary to Ed's perceived personal EXPERIENCE with the LDS. Lastly, you do see the logical consequence of your view that many Mormons really want to become Christians, don't you? What kind of a God would deny the opportunity to a "true seeker" (you still haven't gievn me a definition of such a person that jibes with Romans 3:11)? Couldn't He have provided the "right fork" for such an individual to walk toward instead of letting this true, honest seeker go without finding the Christ he really needed? To suggest that those who are truly seeking do not find Jesus is calling that same Jesus a liar (Matthew 7:7-8); and it is also making a pretty horrible statement on the power and sovereignty of God by suggesting that sometimes God wants the person to be saved, the person himself wants to be saved, and still things work out where the guy goes to hell. Perhaps the "interrogation lamp" could come off of me for a moment so we can discuss these ramifications. --Joe! |