Results 1 - 6 of 6
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | How do I make sense of the context? | Acts 8:13 | Reformer Joe | 69846 | ||
You wrote: "Actually, you need to make up your mind. No offense, but it sounds like on the one hand you say Jesus' sacrifice was only for those sins commited BEFORE His death on the cross." Please point out where I ever used the word "only." You wrote: "I DO believe that His death is for ALL SINS, for ALL TIME." And what do you mean by saying this? Did his death accomplish the forgiveness of the Christian's sins or not? Your next sentence seems to answer that question with a "no." So if Jesus' death does not result in the forgiveness of ALL my sins, what do you mean when you say He died for ALL SINS for ALL TIME? "But only our PAST sins (the ones we have repented of) are forgiven." Yes, you keep saying that without addressing what I have cited from Scripture. And what you are saying is that the work of Christ requires my repentance for it to be effective. In other words, what ultimately saves me is not what Jesus did, but what I do. He pitches in, but I am a co-savior along with Him? You wrote: "Sins we have not laid down at Jesus' cross are not forgiven." Scriptural support for this...? "Even though the opportunity for forgiveness is given through Jesus." So all Jesus' death did was make an OPPORTUNITY for forgiveness? That is a lot weaker than the position of the Bible: "Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him." --Romans 5:9 "In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace" --Ephesians 1:7 What does redemption mean? All of this is an act on God's part, not ours. And we already have forgiveness of our tresspasses as well, according to the riches of God's grace, not according to our repentence. And again, a verse which you haven't addressed as yet: "For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins." --Colossians 1:13-14 Again we see the redemption, the forgiveness of ains (no mention of only "past sins"). Paul goes further here by emphasizing that we have been transferred by God Himself from one kingdom to another. "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to obtain an inheritance which is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time." --1 Peter 1:3-5 Who caused us to be born again? Me and my repentance or God in his mercy? Note that He didn't just make it possible; he CAUSED it. You wrote: 'Yes, I believe that I am saved by Jesus' obedience and death on the cross. I also believe that I must join hands with Him to "work out my own salvation..."' These two statements are a direct contradiction. If Christ's work completely saves us, then our work does not. If my work saves me in any way, I have reason to boast. See Isaiah 64:6 to see how God views the work of sinful man, and Romans 4:4-5 to see the reason that our work contributes nothing to our own salvation. Incidentally, Philippians 2:12 does indeed tell us to "work out" our own salvation, and not "work for" it. And read the verse that follows it to show that God is already working and active in that individual to accomplish that very purpose. Are you suggesting that we finite human beings really stand in God's way of getting what He wants? "It is a conjuction of Jesus' actions with my own actions that saves me." So Jesus, the Very God of very God, isn't a Savior unless we let Him be one? What powerful creations we humans are! The gospel is NOT a group effort between God and man. "This is what Rom. 8 means. Once we make our own commitment to follow Jesus, no one can seperate us from God." Where is our commitment in Romans 8:28-30 as far as our justification goes? It seems that God is the one who set things up for the Christian long before we even existed. And since "no one" can separate us, does that "no one" include you? If not, please show me from Scripture why not. --Joe! |
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2 | How do I make sense of the context? | Acts 8:13 | David_24597 | 69857 | ||
We have freeedom of choice. If we CHOOSE not to follow God and repent from our sins we will not recieve any redemption. God will not force us to recieve redemption if we choose not to. Yes, our salvation IS a co-effort between us and God. God did His part. We must do ours. James chapter 2 | ||||||
3 | How do I make sense of the context? | Acts 8:13 | cwade | 69860 | ||
David, my dear brother, do you pray for the lost? If you do, do you expect that your prayers will be answered? If so, are you not (in effect) asking God to override that lost person's "freedom to choose"? | ||||||
4 | How do I make sense of the context? | Acts 8:13 | David_24597 | 69861 | ||
I pray for the lost to repent and be saved. I pray for God to listen to them when they DO repent. God WILL NOT take away an individual's freedom of choice. If He would do that then Satan would never have fallen in the first place and ALL of God's creations are nothing more than slaves to a dictator. I REFUSE to believe that. Adam and Eve were given a choice whether or not to eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Noah was given the choice to build the ark. Abraham was given a choice to follow God. We are given a choice to repent or not. Jos. 24:15; Isa. 7:15 just to name a few. If I have no freedom of choice then I would rather die than live as a slave forever. I could go on and on here but I think these things are pretty obvious. | ||||||
5 | How do I make sense of the context? | Acts 8:13 | cwade | 69866 | ||
Brother, from your response it is obvious that we stand on the precipice of some pretty deep issues here: The Soverignty of God, Predestination vs. Free Will, etc, etc... All of these have been debated ad nauseum on this forum and throughout the ages. There are many brothers on this forum who are far more qualified than me to discuss these issues, and I urge you to read previous posts on these topics. I have had my eyes opened by paying attention to my elders here!! (We may get yelled at for taking up space on these issues:-)) I do just want to say that I believe God is absolutely and totally in control. I believe satan cannot, and never has, taken a breath without God's permission (note I said PERMISSION, not APPROVAL!!! They are 2 different things!) I also believe that coming to accept Christ is revelational because our ability to independently discover has been destroyed by sin. "We are no longer detached, disinterested observers". Belief is something that is granted to us (Philipians 1:29). It is God's leading that causes our belief to happen. God doesn't animate your arms and legs, He changes your heart, knowing what you will do in response. | ||||||
6 | How do I make sense of the context? | Acts 8:13 | David_24597 | 69878 | ||
I would agree with that wade???. I'm new to this forum (just joined a day or so ago) and don't know how to navigate it to view all those other posts you mentioned. I have heard though of the "once saved always saved" theory (about 20 years ago) and decided then that it wasn't Biblical (just some texts taken out of context and human supposition added to them to make them say something they really don't). There's too many other verses in the Bible that show that this theory is wrong. Get yourself a good concordance and try to argue the other side for a while LOL. Sometimes I do that myself. Approach the subject from every angle you can think of and find ALL the Bible texts that talk about this same subject. It will take you several days though LOL but in the end you will know exactly what the Bible says about it. | ||||||