Results 1 - 9 of 9
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | EdB | 53408 | ||
Simchat give me a demonstration of the existence of the Tree of Life from the Bible. I don't want to cut and paste verses just a verse or two that demonstrates in an understandable way the "Tree of Life". Before you ask I will give verses that demonstrate the existence of the trinity. Mark 1:10-11 we see all three God, Son and Holy Spirit. EdB |
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2 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | Simchat Torah | 53420 | ||
Shalom Ed; To explain the Tree of life in the Bible would take a book :-), of which there are many. Let me just post a couple verses here; Gen 1:27 And God filled the man with his shadow, in his shadow God filled him, male and female he filled them. Man was filled (the Hebrew word is better translated as fattened or filled then created) with his shadow, a reflection of God, as man was made male and female, God is male and female, hence the father and mother. Exodus 12:23 When YHWH goes through the land to strike down the Egyptians, he will see the blood on the top and sides of the doorframe and will pass over that doorway, and he will not permit the destroyer to enter your houses and strike you down. If you read this passage very carefully, ask yourself these questions, who is going through the land killing? The destroyer. Who is the destroyer that will strike the Egyptians down? In Exodus 12:12 YHWH says he will strike the down the Egyptians, YHWH is the destroyer. Now who stands at the door preventing the destroyer from entering the houses with the blood? As the text says “he” it is referring back to YHWH. So YHWH stands at the door preventing YHWH from destroying those inside. Two YHWH’s, (I still believe that YHWH is one as in the Shema of Dt 6:4, but you have to undersand the Hebraic understanding of the word echad – one). The father (equated with biynah – understanding) is YHWH and the mother (equated with chachmah – wisdom) is YHWH. The son is ehyeh (I am). There are other passages as well that show two YHWH’s. Exodus 24:10 And they saw the God of Israel and under his feet was like workings for understanding (biynah – father/YHWH) the saphiyr (singular for sephirot) and like a tree (literally backbone, the tree of a man) of heaven for cleanliness. Proverbs 3:18 She (wisdom – chachmah/mother/YHWH) is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her. This is a case where you can translate this passage several different ways. My translation is just as valid as the KJV or NIV, as I said in another post, ones belief system will dictate how the texts are translated. These passages and my explanation will by no means convince anyone that the tree of life is real, that would take much more than I could put here. Shalom Simchat Torah |
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3 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | EdB | 53437 | ||
Simchat You made my point. You in effort to downplay the mysticism of Kabbalah attempted to compared the mystery of the Trinity to the mystery of Kabbalah Tree of Life. I said there was no comparison one the Trinity could obviously be seen within the confines of the Bible and one Kabbalah was founded in the “wonderings” of man. You said not so that the Kabbalah was founded in the teaching of the Bible. I then asked for a demonstration of what you were saying. By your own admission the Kabbalah would take a book to explain yet I can and did demonstrate the Trinity in two verses. You then attempted to explain Kabbalah using biblical verses that quite frankly seemed more like a bad dream than a explanation of a better understanding of God. There is absolutely no comparison, Kabbbalah is nothing more than mysticism under the guise of religion, while the Trinity can easily be seen within the confines of the Bible. Let’s make no more attempt to legitimize something so mired in “deeper understandings”, alternate interpretations of scripture, word plays and to me convoluted logic by saying it is just like the mystery of the Trinity. EdB |
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4 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | Simchat Torah | 53438 | ||
Shalom Ed; I am sorry, but I am afraid that I do not understand your point here. Are you attempting to say that Mark 1:10-11 is proof positive in the existence of the Trinity? I see God, his son, and a dove. If this is the case there are many more trinities than this. How about the account of the burning bush, you have a trinity, God speaking, a bush and fire. Are they a trinity? How about the pillars of fire and cloud where God speaks out of them? How about Psalms 98:1; “Sing to YHWH a new song, for he has done marvelous works, his right hand and his holy arm bring salvation.” Hear we have YHWH and his right hand and holy arm which brings salvation. I have studied the trinity doctrine, I know the verses backwards and forward to support the doctrine. Do not forget that I agree with the trinity doctrine, in a sense, a little differently but similar. The Kabbalah is much more than a simple little phrase like three gods in one, the Tree of life is a multi faceted paradigm. It deals with every aspect of the Bible, from God to man to the universe. It is not that it would take a book to explain the Tree of life, but that the contents within it would take a book. In order to fully understand the Tree of life, you must understand all of its components. Trying to explain the Tree of life to you or anyone not familiar with it, would be like trying to explain the Bible to someone who has never heard of it before. Can you explain the whole Bible to someone with a few verses? We all know that the Kabbalah is an abhorance to you. That is understandable, you have been taught that it is evil, I was too. I rejected the Kabbalah out of hand becase it was evil, but when I started learning it, I found that it was Biblical. How many times do we reject a doctrine because we were told it was wrong and we do not even know what it is? Ed, you have no clue what the tree of life or the ten sephirot are and how they are related to the Bible, so how can you reject something you know nothing about. Shalom Simchat Torah |
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5 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | EdB | 53443 | ||
Simchat Mark 1:10-11 demonstrates the Trinity in that we see all three personages of the trinity The Father proclaiming His Son, The Son Jesus and the Holy Spirit as of a dove descending upon the Son. Surely you had to be aware of this classical demonstration of the trinity. Your right I’m not student nor expert of Kabbalah, though I have studied it enough to dismiss it as mysticism that even orthodox Judaism rejects. Do I abhor it? Not per se, personally I view is a an attempt by man to try to rationalize something he couldn’t possibly understand. Throughout history man, seemingly unable to accept the fact that God chose to keep certain aspects or traits of Himself secret, has tried to rationalize, philosophize, invent, and explain these unrevealed aspects of God. I view these attempts to be nothing more than exercises in human pride. To try to give the law or torah a personage and then seek to connect that personage along with other invented personages from actions or manifestations of God into a Tree of Life is nonsense. You quickly approach creating your own God rather than worshipping the true God. Simcaht I believe that is the god you worship a created god rather than a God the Creator. In the mighty name of Jesus EdB |
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6 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | Simchat Torah | 53446 | ||
Shalom Ed; If you have studied the Tree of Life (which is only a small part of Kabbalah)of the teachings of Kabbalah, since you have studied it sufficiently to know that it is not true, could you please give me brief explanation of what it is that you disagree with? Shalom Simchat Torah |
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7 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | EdB | 53461 | ||
Simchat This is a Christian forum not a Kabbalah forum where we have chosen to study the authentic not the counterfeit. Would it do any good for me to pull out my old books research your question and produce an answer. I would imagine you have a rebuttal to any objection I might raise. However Kabbalah is known to be mysticism, has it’s roots in mysticism, is summarily rejected my orthodox Jews and Christians alike, for me to open the door for you play upon my lack of understanding would be foolishness on my part. Paul confronted many like you and this was his encouragement to Timothy. “O Timothy, guard what has been entrusted to you, avoiding worldly and empty chatter and the opposing arguments of what is falsely called "knowledge"— 1 Tim. 6:20 Incidentally Joseph Smith the founder of the Mormons was a great fan of Kabbalah that in itself should be a flashing red light to any that would entertain your bent. As I have said I have studied Kabbalah enough to know it is a lie, I have Jewish friends that I have discussed this subject with and they too have concluded Kabbalah is birthed in mysticism. For me that is enough. EdB |
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8 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | Simchat Torah | 55842 | ||
Shalom Ed, Just returned from a nice long vacation :-) As I thought, you cannot refute the doctrine of Kabbalah. The word Trinity is not in the bible anymore than the word Kabbalah (though its root Kabal is). The Trinity doctrine is an interpretation of scripture just as the Kabbalah is. Unless I am mistaken, I thought this was a "Study Bible" Forum not a "christian doctrine only study bible" forum. Shalom Simchat Torah |
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9 | self control / spirit control | 1 Cor 9:25 | kalos | 55849 | ||
"Cabala is still essentially an occultic system'" 'What is the Christian response to Cabala? This is an important question because in today's “occult revolution” where all dimensions of the occult are being probed, there has been a revived interest in Cabala among both Jew and Gentile. Although its Jewish origin makes it unique, Cabala is still essentially an occultic system, and thus must be classified among all other occultic systems as being incompatible with the historic Judaeo-Christian faiths. Its theology is essentially pantheistic in that it teaches that all reality springs directly from God's own essence. Even if one believes that these emanations from God's essence have gone through a descent of ten spheres on four different levels, the conclusion is inescapable that even the being on the lowest level is still of one essence with God; and thus, ultimately, he is God. Such a concept is incompatible with the biblical God, who created the world out of nothing, not out of Himself (Gen. 1:1). The Hebrew word for “create” is “bara,” which indicates something coming out of nothing. _____________ "Cabalistic method of interpretation is neither acknowledged in the Bible, nor justified by it." _____________ 'Although Cabalists' insistence upon the inspiration of Scripture in its literal form was commendable, their carrying this point to the extent of seeking to find hidden meaning in its numerical arrangements was unwarranted. Depending upon one's assumptions, one may apply Cabalistic methods to almost any piece of literature and draw almost any interpretation from it. Cabalistic method of interpretation is neither acknowledged in the Bible, nor justified by it. The application of this method of the Bible had produced interpretations that are not supported by Scripture, and, in fact, are something directly opposed to it, in its obvious context. 'In my years of research in comparative religions I have become persuaded that essentially there are only two metaphysical interpretations of reality available to us: the Biblical and the occultic. In seeking to support the inspiration of Scripture, the Jewish Cabalists applied to it a method of interpretation foreign to Scripture, but familiar to the occult, and thus these Jews slipped over from a Biblical understanding of reality to an occultic one' (STATEMENT DC040, Cabala by Elliot Miller. www.equip.org/free/DC040.htm) |
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