Results 1 - 9 of 9
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | Jesified | 72131 | ||
I would never "throw out" a verse of scripture. However, we must rightly divide the word of truth. (2 Timothy 2:15). Paul was not sick. By that I mean that he was not referring to a sickness in 2 Corinthians 12:7. The term "thorn in the flesh" is best described as the slang of that period which can not be interpreted literally. Paul, since he was a well learned scholar in the practices of Judaism and what we know as the Old Testament, was probably quoting Numbers 33:55. "But if ye will not drive out the inhabitants of the land from before you; then it shall come to pass, that those which ye let remain of them shall be pricks in your eyes, and thorns in your sides, and shall vex you in the land wherein ye dwell."-Numbers 33:55 “Know for a certainty that the LORD your God will no more drive out any of these nations from before you; but they shall be snares and traps unto you, and scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes, until ye perish from off this good land which the LORD your God hath given you.” -Joshua 23:13 “Wherefore I also said, I will not drive them out from before you; but they shall be as thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare unto you.” -Judges 2:3 There is a rule in proper hermeneutics, or Bible interpretation, and that is that if the same phrase is used in the Bible multiple times referring to one thing, then it is more than likely that it means the same thing in all accounts of that phrase. There are two accounts of the usage of the term “thorn in the side” which I have listed above, and one usage of “thorns in your eyes” which means the same thing, just on a different part of the body. Since the terms "thorn in the side," “thorns in your eyes,” and "thorn in the flesh" have a similar enough meaning, this rule would apply. In all the Old Testament appearances of this word we find that they actually refer to people. Therefore, it is logical to say that Paul’s thorn was also a person, or group of people. Now on to whom Paul’s thorn was. If you read the book of Acts where it tells of Paul’s journeys you will see that groups of Jews stirred up the people against him. “But the Jews stirred up the devout and honourable women, and the chief men of the city, and raised persecution against Paul and Barnabas, and expelled them out of their coasts.” -Acts 13:50 “But the unbelieving Jews stirred up the Gentiles, and made their minds evil affected against the brethren.” -Acts 14:2 “But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy, and spake against those things which were spoken by Paul, contradicting and blaspheming.” -Acts 13:45 “And when Gallio was the deputy of Achaia, the Jews made insurrection with one accord against Paul, and brought him to the judgment seat,” -Acts 18:12 “And after five days Ananias the high priest descended with the elders, and with a certain orator named Tertullus, who informed the governor against Paul.” -Acts 24:1 “Then the high priest and the chief of the Jews informed him against Paul, and besought him,” -Acts 25:2 “And when he was come, the Jews which came down from Jerusalem stood round about, and laid many and grievous complaints against Paul, which they could not prove” -Acts 25:7 As you can see, the Jews cause quite a lot of trouble for Paul, which is why I firmly believe that they were his “thorn in the flesh” Where does it say that Timothy was sick? Also, I’ll have to get back to you when I get a chance to look at those verses in 1 Corinthians. Jesified |
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2 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | inmyheart | 72161 | ||
Jesified, Greetings, I also posted on this topic, "thorn in the flesh," and I also agree what the Word of God says concerning this matter. This is what I posted: "Paul's thorn. "...There was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me…" (2 Corinthians 12:7). This verse is frequently used by ministers to prove that sickness can be the will of God, and that Paul was sick. First of all, even if Paul was sick, it is no proof that it was the will of God. David committed murder and adultery – was that the will of God? Judas betrayed Jesus – was that a moral act? Just because someone in the Bible did something does not automatically make it right. Even Satan is in the Bible. You have to read the implied principles from the experiences of biblical character as well as the directly stated principles in the Bible. Nevertheless, Paul was really a solid proof of the supernatural healing power of God – even in his experience. Many Christians have been deceived in this area. Notice Paul says he had "a thorn in the flesh." The words "scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes" in Joshua 23:13 are used to describe people; the words "thorns in your sides" in Judges 2:3 are also used the same way. Since when did it become a sickness? Paul was simply using an expression commonly used in those days. When you say, "Tom is a pain in the neck," you are talking about a person that bothers or annoys you, not a sickness. To further confirm that, Paul says the thorn was "a messenger of Satan." This tells us it was a person or demon, and that he was from Satan, not God. What Paul experienced was most likely persecution from people (inspired by Satan). Most of them followed Paul around to preach circumcision to the people right after Paul leaves a city. Some even reacted to Paul's preaching with physical violence. This is why the evil spirit or "messenger" was a "thorn in the flesh," or a "pain in the neck." You need to know the truth about the biblical passages that have been used to preach sickness. Many times those passages are some of the greatest proofs for healing. Some of them prove neither healing or sickness – just the need for wisdom. For example, if the Bible says that someone accidentally fell off a building and died, does that prove sickness, or that it is not God's will to heal and protect? No, it proves the need for wisdom and caution. By the way, this happened and Paul resurrected the dead man by the power of God (Acts 20:9-12). (end of post) I support your post and encourage you to keep posting no matter what feed back you may get. I also was labeled, but Praise God for His Grace! God bless |
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3 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | EdB | 72168 | ||
Inmyheart I don't believe anyone denied healing. I also don’t think anyone said to accept sickness and not pray for healing. However that is a long way from saying a true Christian will never get sick and if they do it is because they lack faith or have unconfessed sin in their lives. Or that God has to heal you. Mercifully God does heal many of us, but He doesn’t have to. If your sickness or lack of healing serves His purpose then you will not be healed. Yes, God does allow sickness to come into our lives to chasten us and to lead us to correction Heb. 12:5-12, sometimes because of sin Num. 12:10-12, sometimes so he can show His mercy and grace 2 Cor. 1:3-7, sometimes even to strengthen us and our faith 2 Cor. 12:7-10 1 Pet 5:10, and even sometimes for no reason we can see as in the case of Job Ex4:11 and John 9:1-3. Understand you have not been labeled but the Word of Faith doctrine you sometimes tout here has been. Peace to you EdB |
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4 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | Jesified | 72195 | ||
How can you say that God would afflict His children? To think such a thing would lower God to the status of a child abuser. Would you give your son or daughter the Ebola virus just so they could stay humble or for whatever crazy excuse you want to come up with? No, of course you wouldn't. Then why would God, who has both wisdom and resources beyond our knowledge, decide that sickness is such a great tool. Did you forget to read the hundreds of passages that says God loves us? "If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children HOW MUCH MORE shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask Him?" Matthew 7:11 I've posted on healing many times before and I know you've responded to at least one or two of those because I remember your screen name. As far as I'm concerned I've tried to represtent the truth of the Word of God as best I can, but if you personally want to live with cancer or AIDS, then so be it. I don't even know what to tell you. I pray that you have an experience with God that will take the scales off your eyes. Jesified |
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5 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | CDBJ | 72203 | ||
Dear Justified, I don’t know how long you have been a Christian but for me it’s been close to 37 years now and believe me when I tell you that you are barking up the wrong tree. Someone very near and dear to you, who is a very strong believer, is going to have to die of some nasty disease before you wake up. We just lost a missionary doctor who loved the Lord and had super strong faith. He was serving the Lord with all his heart in a foreign country. He had a wife and three kids and just died from cancer that has been eating at him for close to two years now. When are you going to realize that we live in a sin sick world that God won’t deal with until the proper time? If God would have dealt with all the sin that is in the world say fifteen years ago where would that have left you? Do you think that you are going to live forever in the body that you now reside in? Everyone is going to die from something unless the rapture takes them first! Have you never even had a head cold or been sick with anything? If your answer is no, I am telling you right now that that is going to change and if you are basing your faith on that it to will be shaken to the core. God has promised us eternal life but it won’t be in these miserable bodies. Everyone that you witness to is listening to what you say and they are watching your life. The moment you get very sick your whole testimony will go right down the drain, and there goes a perfect opportunity for someone else to lead them to Christ because you have muddied up the water! I hope that you wake up before the Lord orients you to grace the hard way. In love, CDBJ |
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6 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | Jesified | 72207 | ||
I don't know why that missionary died. But God knows, and that's why we have the Bible. God knew that things were going to happen to us in this fallen world and He knew that we would need a guiding light. "Thy word is a lamp unto my feet and a light unto my path" -Psalm 119:105. I'm only 19 and i've only been saved since April of 2001, but I also know that I have a call of God upon my life to preach the Gospel. Not just a calling in the general sense that everyone is called, but as my profession. I might not have much in the way of experience, but I am growing in knowledge every day. I'd rather have it that way. It seems that the more experience some people have, the more their theology is baised on that experience than it is on the Word of God. It makes me want to cry when I think about how people could be so blind to look directly at God's Word and recognize that it's the truth, but not see what it is saying to them. Jesified And why does everyone keep calling me Justified, it's Jesified. |
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7 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | CDBJ | 72212 | ||
Well Jesified, I thought that you fit under the name justified like the rest of us? This is going to be sort and sweet since I am getting very sleepy. Romans 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Romans 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. Romans 4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: Romans 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. Romans 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. I hoped that you would fit into these categories of Justified and that’s why I spelled it that way; am I wrong? Have a nice day, CDBJ |
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8 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | Jesified | 72230 | ||
You're not wrong, you're just something like the third or fourth person to say it. I thought it was some inside thing, like the half the forum ganging up on me because I listen to Word of Faith preachers. Jesified |
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9 | Divine Healing? | Matthew | CDBJ | 72259 | ||
Greetings Jesified, stop and think a minute, we don’t have anything to gain by telling you what to believe and we for sure don’t want your money; we are just trying to tell you the truth. Have you ever noticed a faith healer in later years, wearing glasses some wear contacts? That being the case they just blew their testimony even if they get a head cold their doctrinal creditability goes out the window! God can heal anyone he wants to if it pleases him and it is in his plan. One of the most spiritually gifted people that I have ever listened to is a gal by the name of Johnnie Erickson Tada, she is a Quadra pelagic that has lead numerous people to faith in Christ. I am being up front with you when I tell you that most of the so-called faith healers have their own agenda in mind. Check out their standard of living compared to your average pastor, it will literally blow your mind. If you think we are wrong check it out for your self. Titus 1:10-11 For there are many insubordinate, both idle talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision, [11] whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole households, teaching things which they ought not, for the sake of dishonest gain. Have a nice day, CDBJ |
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