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NASB | Romans 9:21 Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use? |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | Romans 9:21 Does the potter not have the right over the clay, to make from the same lump [of clay] one object for honorable use [something beautiful or distinctive] and another for common use [something ordinary or menial]? |
Bible Question:
I am wondering if a calvinist could explain to me why God, if all things are ordained by him, would judge people? what I mean is, if God made us all, and God chose everything we would do, why did he give us the 'illusion' of freewill, and why would he judge us for things he made us do? I can understand it if I except God delegates Authority to man so that we may choose to love him, then I can see why all the suffering and death and pain are worth it to God, because some will "choose" to love him, But if in the end we cannot choose, why did he not simply make us perfect in the first place? God is outside of time, so to me words like foreordained, and foreknew, are meaningless in the context of God himself, though they obviously have meaning to man. |
Bible Answer: You wrote: "I am wondering if a calvinist could explain to me why God, if all things are ordained by him, would judge people? what I mean is, if God made us all, and God chose everything we would do, why did he give us the 'illusion' of freewill, and why would he judge us for things he made us do?" That is a good question. So goood, in fact, that the Spirit-inspired Paul addressed it in the New Testament. Here is what God has to say about it: 'You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?" On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this," will it? Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use? What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction? And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory, even us, whom He also called, not from among Jews only, but also from among Gentiles.' --Romans 9:19-24 Probably not a satisfactory answer for many, but it is the one God gives. Notice that there is not one shred of commentary here regarding man's choice in the matter. The Potter has the right. We are born as "children of wrath" by our very nature as Ephesians 2:3 states. We are part of humanity, which was represented before God by Adam. He blew it for all of us when he fell. Jesus Christ, in turn, rescued/saved/redeemed the "vessels of mercy" which he "prepared BEFOREHAND for glory." You wrote: 'I can understand it if I except God delegates Authority to man so that we may choose to love him, then I can see why all the suffering and death and pain are worth it to God, because some will "choose" to love him, But if in the end we cannot choose, why did he not simply make us perfect in the first place?' He did create humanity morally upright in the first place, but fallible. Humanity fell from that position of moral uprightness. You wrote: "God is outside of time, so to me words like foreordained, and foreknew, are meaningless in the context of God himself, though they obviously have meaning to man." It is true that God transcends time, and even created time. However, He does also act within the time-space dimensions of the universe that he created. Despite knowing the end from the beginning, he still responds to our actions. This is how I see things like Genesis 6 where God "is sorry" that He made humanity. He knew how they would turn out, and he knew that Christ would redeem His people from among fallen humanity, but God in his holiness also makes a perfect space-time response to the pre-Flood condition of the world. It is a mind-numbing thing to assess both the transcendence and the immanence of our Lord, but we have to be careful not to go too far to either extreme. "Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways!" --Romans 11:33 --Joe! |