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NASB | Matthew 26:29 "But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father's kingdom." |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | Matthew 26:29 "But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father's kingdom." |
Subject: What is 'the fruit of the vine'? |
Bible Note: Joe Are you saying by this "God receives the glory when we partake of the wine of communion. Until the temperance movement of the 19th century got its claws into the sacrament, wine was used almost exclusively since the first century. And God indeed receives the glory when it is administered rightly." That because we don't use alcoholic wine God receives no glory in communion? And that communion without alcohol is not administer rightly? You also said “Wine is only detrimental to our well-being when it is used in excess. The same can be said of food. The sin in Scripture is not alcohol use, but alcohol abuse. “ Yet science has proven even a small amounts of alcohol has negative effects on our body. While food can cause us problems, food has not been proven to alter our body chemistry to make itself addictive. You also said, “Jesus drank wine. Jesus changed water into wine. It was NOT unfermented grape juice. As one of my favorite writers, Douglas Wilson, put it, to claim that the first-century beverage of the Lord's Table was grape juice is as silly as saying that Paul wore a necktie when he preached.” If the Jew was so particular to insure all forms of leaven was removed from even the house during Passover why do we want to suggest they brought leaven in with the wine? You asked, “Because it is the truth. What amazes me is the Herculean attempts to make it seem as if it weren't fermented. Why is it so important that everyone be convinced that the wine of the Bible WASN'T alcoholic? “ Because it serves as a detriment for some from even being tempted to try a little. As Paul said if it might make your brother stumble stay away from it. You went on and said, “Now let's be clear: I am not saying that everyone MUST drink alcohol. I rarely drink at all myself. I also acknowledge that there are times when it would be detrimental to drink (not for myself, but for the conscience of another). However, it is an extra-biblical, legalistic sin to forbid the drinking of wine; and I would prefer to use wine in communion, simply because it is what Christ consecrated for the celebration.” Personally I would be more convince your not trying to self justify yourself if you said you never drink. I know personally about alcohol and I can say with no hesitation life is better without it than with it. Again I have had to pray over broken and dead bodies killed by alcohol, I have had to minister to men and women ruined by alcohol. I have had to hold children and tell them God loves them after their lives, home and families were wreaked by alcohol. To me there is no good in alcohol, no none. If you want to argue Jesus made alcohol, understand you may be providing just the argument someone without your will power is looking for to get involved with alcohol. Personally I want no part of that involvement. Sorry I just can’t buy your argument. I see no good in alcohol as found in wine. EdB |