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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Is Limited Atonement Bibical? | NT general Archive 1 | Reformer Joe | 34558 | ||
Zach: Some of the very verses you cite would be disastrous in themselves if we were to understand that "all" meant "each and every." Take 1 Corinthians 15:22. Is every human truly made alive because of what Christ did? That seems to smack of universalism. The unrepentant atheist, the Muslim, the Hindu, and the cultist are all made alive in Christ? Matthew 9:26 is another example. With God all things are possible. Is it possible for God to lie? (Numbers 23:19) Clearly Jesus is not saying that God can sin or not be all powerful or not be omniscient or all-wise or perfect. As we can see, there are all sorts of qualified "all's" in Scripture. It is a leap in logic, however, to say, if one reasonably concludes from the context that "all" does not mean "each and every" in one case that one can indiscriminately dismiss this use in all cases (and by that I DO mean "each and every case"). Paul spends the first 2.5 chapters of Romans elaborating how indeed each and every human being has sinned and falls short of God's glory. However, he does not teach universalism, so any reference to ALL being saved cannot mean that every single human being will be in Heaven. Therefore, the following statement you made does not logically follow: 'In each of the above verses the same Greek word "pas" is used, so to replace it in one verse would mean you have to replace it in all these verses.' The term "limited atonement" (I prefer "particular redemption" myself to avoid misunderstanding) means that His saving grace is limited in its SCOPE, not in its power or efficacy. In other words, Christ's sinless life, death, and resurrection accomplished completely and totally everything that the Triune God intended it to accomplish. What slanders God, in my opinion, is any view which says that God doesn't ultimately get His own way in every way with His creation. --Joe! |
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2 | Is Limited Atonement Bibical? | NT general Archive 1 | zach† | 34568 | ||
Joe! Neither do I believe in universalism. However I do believe that in the verses i cited, all means all in these verses. And of course whenever the terms particular redemption or limited atonement is mentioned we then are given a denominations particular slant on Scripture. It is my person opinion that denominations divide, but Christ unites. Doctrinal difference between the various sects have existed as early in my reading since 1 Cor. Chapter 1 where Paul states: 1Co 1:12 Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. 13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul? (KJV) one says I'm Methodist, another says I'm Reformed, still another says I'm Pentecostal, was Christ divided, or were you baptized in the name of Calvin, or Wesley (my paraphrase of 1 Cor.1:12-13) (The zach paraphrase of 1 Cor. 1:12-13) I don't expect you to adopt my interpretation for your own, we can discuss it, and yet disagree. But just so you know, I cannot agree with the 5 points of Calvinism,. It's not that I haven't studied them in detail, I just find too much scripture that goes against that teaching. Please don't ask me which scripture. I have discussed this too often in the past with too many of the Reformed faith and have always found these discussions to be unproductive and unfruitful. And yes I do know all the verses they use to support what they believe. I have seen them all many times, and have considered each one of them without excluding any of them. I don't say that to be mean, or disrespectful but just to be open and honest. In Christ zach† |
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