Results 1 - 3 of 3
|
|
|||||
Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Still waiting.... | 1 Cor 8:5 | pcdarcan | 130927 | ||
I wasn't going to re-enter/reply (as previously stated) to this thread, but Mary... your sincere response urged me on. Bro. Tim responds that "basic logic demands that we start with the simplest statements first and then build from there." Here's another approach. Anytime a scripture (or portion of a verse) is extracted out of its context, read the surrounding verses for contextual understanding of the Bible to see what point is being established. Tim states, "It cannot be true that there are 'other gods' and are not 'other gods' at the same time! These are two contadictory statements." However, within Bible context, it can be true that there ARE 'other gods' (after all, why would God warn against worshipping 'other gods'), but no 'other [true] God'. Notice the capital "G" in the title "God" and singular nature in KJV Isaiah 45:21 "... there is no God else besides me". Interesting is the context of the preceding quote: "... there is no God else besides me; a just God and a Savior; there is none beside me." These qualifying remarks clarify what this scripture is really talking about. God Almighty is called a "just God" and "a Savior". And here's the point, within the context there is no other true God, just one God in whom salvation lies - a recurring theme in Isaiah. I believe that Tim may be taking some verses too literal or not allowing the surrounding verses to explain the meaning. The surrounding scriptures highlight the issue that Isaiah is trying to present, there is only one true God. Of this true God, the sciptures saith: "I have made the earth, and created man upon it;" (Isa 45:12a), "a just God and a Savior" (Isa 45:21). Isaiah (under inspiration) is building a case for worshipping the only true God and Creator for note Isa 45:20 "Assemble yourselves together and come; draw near together, ye that are escaped of the nations; they have no knowledge that set up the wood of their graven image, and pray unto a god that CANNOT save." And, that's the crux of Isaiah's writing, there is no other God (capital G) other than the true God. Isa 45:5 (American Std. Bible) says: "I am Jehovah, and there is none else; besides me there is no God." (Interesting that when Bibles include the name of God, it becomes less confusing to the reader.) That there are 'other gods' though (small "g") is very clear from the Bible. The statement "false gods do not really exist" is a loaded statement. Molech was a god who was worshipped, he doesn't have to be real - just real to those who worship him. Of course, we know Satan is real and was called "...the god of this world [who] has blinded the minds of unbelievers..." - NIV 2 Cor 4:4 He even tried to get Jesus (in his weakened physical state) to worship him (imagine that!) - Mt 4:9 KJV "And saith (Satan) unto him (Jesus), All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me." I don't doubt that Tim believes in his interpretation of his quoted verses and I actually understand what he is saying - I just respectfully disagree because I surmise that they are taken out of context. Hope this is helpful. |
||||||
2 | Still waiting.... | 1 Cor 8:5 | pcdarcan | 131021 | ||
Ooooo, so that's what this is all about... you don't believe that Jesus is a god and you're trying to disprove it. I didn't read all the entries and was only responding to what I believe was contridictory to many scriptures that clearly articulate that there are 'other gods'. From your previous post, Bro Tim, you make the statement: 'let's start with this scripture (in Isaiah) and build from there'. I have discovered in my Bible research that no one text stands alone - or else you can make the Bible say just about anything (I've seen people do this). To explain a debatable scripture, you need to have other verses in the Bible do that. That's the difference between Bible understanding and interpreting the Bible. The Bible does a find job in interpreting itself. For instance, when the apostle Paul, writing under inspiration said, "They do not believe, because their minds have been kept in the dark by the evil god of this world..." 2 Cor 4:4(Good News Bible), this verse doesn't fit into your argument that there are no other "real" gods. You can go back to those select verses in Isaiah all you want, but no scripture stands alone and that's why God supplied us with the entire Bible. Two things. 1) It sounds like you are going to a great extent to disprove that Jesus is not a god - now I see why you may be missing the clear statement from the apostle Paul in 2 Cor 4:4. The apostle Paul was inspired to write in that verse about a "real" god...in particular Satan, a powerful god in his own right because he blinds the minds of the unbelievers - Satan also convinced a third of the angels to worship and follow him. Remember that he tried to get Jesus to do an act of worship, too? A god Satan is and he acts like one. 2) Going back to the illustration of a puzzle piece forced into a place it doesn't belong... as long as that piece stays, that forces other pieces (2 Cor 4:4) not to fit - it's a domino effect. The result is that you never get a clear picture of the whole puzzle. Thanks for the feedback Bro. Tim. I'm not trying to convince you, just didn't want my points to be lost. I think this has been a healthy discussion, hope readers have enjoyed it. Signing off... |
||||||
3 | Still waiting.... | 1 Cor 8:5 | Morant61 | 131032 | ||
Greetings Pcdarcan! Not to be mean my friend, but it usually is a good idea to read the thread that you are contributing to! ;-) John 1:1, among many others, is quite clear that Jesus is God, not 'a god'. This is completely in harmony with what Jehovah said in Isaiah about there being no other 'elohim' besides Him. The JW's, since they are a cult, do not want to acknowledge that Jesus is in fact God. So, they try to make Him into a created being, a lesser god - in direct defiance to Jehovah's clear statement. Does Satan being called the 'god of this world' indicate that he is in fact a 'elohim', when Jehovah clearly said that there are no other 'elohim' besides Him? No! As I have pointed out many times, there are things that are called 'gods' that are not really gods. Consider Is. 37:19 - "They have thrown their gods into the fire and destroyed them, for they were not gods but only wood and stone, fashioned by human hands." Here, false gods are called 'elohim', but then in the same verse they are declared to not be 'elohim'. Why? Because, calling something a 'god' simply doesn't make it one! So, if you choose to ignore Jehovah's clear statements, that is you choice! As for me, I'll trust Him rather than the JW's. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
||||||