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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Preterism refuted using Scripture alone? | Matt 16:28 | Coper44 | 183673 | ||
Doc, Thanks again for the spirit with which you write. Others have pointed out to me the need to hold the creeds and traditions of the church in high regard. And I do. However, I am trying to focus entirely on the content of Scripture to resolve this issue. In this instance, the creeds and traditions only serve as distractions (please don't respond to that I do mean it with respect). As I've said before, if one focuses on placing Scripture into its proper context everything should eventually fall into place. I am aware that its not easy to do that. And, I'm also aware that most interpreters believe they are doing it. However, I'm trying not to become distracted by those who would dismiss this issue or treat it like it is disruptive to the unity of the church etc. And, I do say this with respect also: When I'm told that "we aren't assured of possessing all of that truth in this life time" I cringe a little. Who gets to determine which truths to pursue and which truth is beyond pursuit? After all, the Bible is God's revealed truth. Some resort to those "unsearchable truth" type statements when they are challenged to defend a doctrine that is becoming indefensible for them. I can tell that you are more learned and informed than others I've corresponded with, but I honestly don't consider a preteristic approach to Scripture beyond searchable truth. Again, please help me focus on the mindset of the first century church in regard to the writer's intentions and their expectations. Did they believe Jesus would return in their lifetime? If so, didn't they believe it because an inspired apostle or the Lord himself told them that he would return soon, in their lifetime? Did they believe that the coming of Christ would bring relief to them from the afflictions they were suffering? (II Thess. 1:6-8) Aren't we really reading someone elses mail and trying to apply it to ourselves? Again, the reason we should make every effort to determine the context of Scripture is to determine what God's Word means. And, that is everyone's goal, right? Coper |
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2 | Preterism refuted using Scripture alone? | Matt 16:28 | DocTrinsograce | 183682 | ||
Dear Coper, You asked, "Who gets to determine which truths to pursue and which truth is beyond pursuit?" "Beyond pursuit?" I did not use this wording. What I wrote was "we aren't assured of possessing all truth." You have brought up an entirely different subject. All that the Bible contains is true, but the Bible does not contain all truth. In that sense, there are things that we know to be true that Paul, for example, did not know. Some of the doctrines we hold as commonplace today, were not so conveniently articulated even by the apostles. In the intervening centuries, by careful, considered, contemplation, and cogitation of the revelation of Scripture has yielded a great deal of fruit. "Now we see darkly, as in a mirror." But occasionally, by exertion and debate, we are able to see a bit more clearly. For in this process we have Biblical precedent. The prophets desired to understand many things that we now see clearly, because God has provided further revelation (1 Peter 1:10-12). There's even indications in verse 12 that the angelic host of heaven desire for their knowledge to be expanded in some areas. There are a myriad of things to which we simply are not meant to be privy (Deuteronomy 29:29). The old divines deemed that this included the "secret will of God." Some of that will be revealed in time. But there are other things that we simply will never know, even in glory. Isn't that obvious, given our nature and given the nature of our Maker? You asked, "Did they believe Jesus would return in their lifetime?" Yes, they did. Look at John 28:18-24. Here we have John explicitly refuting such a misunderstanding of the words of Christ Himself. Also, as you've pointed out, the Thessalonians were expecting His imminent return. But aren't all the redeemed? And aren't we commanded to do so? (cf Mark 13:31-32) You asked, "If so, didn't they believe it because an inspired apostle or the Lord himself told them that he would return soon, in their lifetime?" (sic) See above. You asked, "Did they believe that the coming of Christ would bring relief to them from the afflictions they were suffering? (II Thess. 1:6-8)" Yes, there is great hope in Christ's return. We long for it because we so deeply desire to behold the Object of our devotion. We long for it because it represents the beginning of the consummation of the final stage of our transformation. I quoted Moltmann just the other day when I posted, "Eschatology means the doctrine of Christian hope, which embraces both the object hoped for and also the hope inspired by it. From first to last, and not merely in epilogue, Christianity is eschatology, is hope, forward looking and forward moving, and therefore is also revolutionizing and transforming the present. The eschatological is not one element of Christianity, but is the medium of Christian faith as such, the key in which everything in it is set, the glow that suffuses everything here in the dawn of an expected new day." You asked, "Aren't we really reading someone elses mail and trying to apply it to ourselves?" (sic) Yes, some of it was "someone else's mail." (Take for example the pastoral epistles.) But how do you think we got that mail? We aren't just snooping! :-) Certainly the Holy Spirit was responsible for the Word being made available to us. (There are many, many other letters and sermons that haven't made it to us... they simply aren't Scripture!) From a purely human standpoint, clearly Timothy and Titus recognized the value of the letters they received from Paul for subsequent generations. Some mail contained explicit instructions for its dissemination (Colossians 4:16); some were written to survive their writers (2 Peter 1:15); some were written directly to all of us (John 20:31; Revelation 1:3). In Him, Doc |
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