Results 1 - 13 of 13
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Jesusman | 30981 | ||
Hello Tim, As for Job, and the LXX using angels, true, it does say that. This was one of the things I was researching this week. However, according to my sources, only the LXX uses "angels". I haven't been able to find another source that uses it. This leads me to think that the true reading was "sons". Next, and for the book of Enoch being used in Jude, yes, and it is directly referenced in Jude 14. However, I wonder why Enoch wasn't placed among the cannon? As for "toutos", It doesn't refer to the angels in verse 6. I spelled it out in my other post I gave to "Discipled". You might want to check it out. Here's the abridged edition. "Toutos" refers to Sodom and Gammorah, not the angels. First, you have a constistant pattern. To mention the angels in verse 6, in verse 7, would break up that pattern. If not, then verse 6 would also refer to the people of egypt from verse 5 in one form or another. As we can see, it doesn't. So, the pattern includes that the example of one verse is separate from the other examples in the context. Then there is a matter of punctuation. There is a greek coma between "sodom and gammorah" and "the cities around them". There is no such punctuation between "sodom" and "Gammorah". This shows that "Sodom and Gammorah" are to be contrasted or compared to "the cities around them". The following verse shows that comparisson. "They (the cities around them), in the same manner as these (Sodom and Gammorah) ...". Jesusman |
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2 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | The Disciple | 31209 | ||
Jesusman, I just got home from a long road trip and heading out again tomorrow. I havent had time to read up on all my grammer of Greek n Hebrew. But I will look into it. But I must ask. Those who wrote the Bible in our language I am presuming took into account all the things you say about punctuation,etc. But then maybe not. I would like to address one thing about Gen 6:4 though before we go on addressing grammer. "There were giants in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them..." Is the punctuation or grammer in this verse questionable also? I ask for sake of argument, it says,"In those days, and also afterward..." Are we agreed that it is speaking of before and after the flood? If not, then tell me what and I will look deeper into HIS word and glean from it. If it is about Pre and Post Flood. Then my question of concern is this: How did Cains lineage make it after the flood to procreate with Seths lineage? This truly is a confusion to me. *shalom* Discipled |
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3 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Morant61 | 31234 | ||
Greetings Discipled! I played "devil's advocate" with Jesusman about Jude 7, now I want to do the same with you. If the line of Seth was unable to survive past the flood, would not the same be true of the Nephilim? So, no matter who the Sons of God were, their offspring must have perished during the flood! Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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4 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Love Fountain | 31255 | ||
Dear Tim, I am confused by your response, "If the line of Seth was unable to survive past the flood, would not the same be true of the Nephilim? So, no matter who the Sons of God were, their offspring must have perished during the flood!" I read what Discipled wrote and he didn't say Seth's line was unable to survive the flood. We do know for sure that Seth's line survived the flood, in the being of Noah. He is asking Jesusman to support his position that instead of angels taking wives of men, Jesusman has chosen to believe that the giants are a by product of the descendants of Cain and Adam mixing blood lines. Discipled also addressed your question regarding whether or not the Nephilim(giants) made it through the flood by quoting Gen 6:4 Gen 6:4 4 The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown. NAS The above verse says Nephilim were on the earth in those days(Noah's days before the flood) and also afterward (this implies after the flood) as Discipled already stated. By the understanding of Gen 6:4 it appears there were two irruption of angels and the after the flood trace is also stated in Gen 6:4 by the fact that they became the mighty men(gibbor), men of old is how we can find them(giants) after the flood in Scripture. Bless you, Love Fountain |
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5 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Jesusman | 31907 | ||
Hello, Whoa, Whoa, Whoa, Whoa ... I have never said that the Niphillim are the offspring of the "sons of God" and the "Daughters of Men" marrying each other, or of Cain's line marrying into Adam's Line. I have only claimed that the Niphillim are mentioned in this passage to give a time reference. No more, no less. I said that the "Mighty men of Old" and "Men of renown" are the offspring, and that they and the Niphillim are two different groups. Get you facts straight the next time you try to quote me. Now, as for Genesis 6:4 and the existance of the Niphillim in relation to Noah's Ark. It says that they existed before the time when the "sons" and "Daughters" married, and existed after that event. It also implies that the event took place well before the time of the Flood. The story of the Flood concludes that all life on the earth, except those in the ark, died. So, the Niphillim could not have survived the flood, unless they were on the Ark. That means that Noah and his family were Niphillim, which is NOT supported anywhere in the Bible, or that the Niphillim were animals, or that they died in the flood, in which case it is a moot point. Jesusman |
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6 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Love Fountain | 32151 | ||
Dear Jesusman, You said,"The story of the Flood concludes that all life on the earth, except those in the ark, died. So, the Niphillim could not have survived the flood, unless they were on the Ark." Please explain the following existence of Giants in the Bible. Num 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight. The giants, the sons of Anak. Some have suggested that the spies imagined there were giants about when they saw great walls, sometimes fifty feet high, and supposed only giants could build them. But the measurements of King Og's iron bedstead given in Deut 3:11 testify to the existence of a race of abnormally large people. Deut 2:10,20 and Gen 14:5 indicate that the "giants" date from as early as patriarchal days, and were given various local designations (Emims, Zamzumims, and Rephaim). In the Hebrew of Deut 2:11 the Anakim are called Rephaim (translated "giants"). Josh 11:22 tells us that Anakim remained in three of the Philistine cities - Gaza, Gath, and Ashdod (Jer 27:5, LXX). The family of Goliath in Gath may have been descendants of these earlier people, for in 2 Sam 21:16-22 and 1 Chron 20:4-8 these Philistine giants are called sons of the Rapa'. The fifteenth century texts from Ugarit mention the Rephaim (C. H. Gordon, Ugaritic Literature, pp. 101-103), who probably were not "shades of the dead" but actually these same mighty people (cf. Ugaritic ilnym and Hebrew ('elim); Job 41:17, Heb. Bible; 41:25, Eng.) from the north, whence came iron processing (cf. Og's bedstead). (from The Wycliffe Bible Commentary, Electronic Database. Copyright (c) 1962 by Moody Press) GIANT GIANT. An abnormally tall and powerful human being of ancient Bible lands; the rendering of several Heb. words. Nephilim (nef'i-lim; Heb. nepilim; Num 13:13). The form of the Heb. word denotes a plural verbal adjective or noun of passive signification, certainly from napal, "to fall," so that the connotation is "the fallen ones," clearly meaning the unnatural offspring that were on the earth in the years before the Flood, "and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them" (Gen 6:4). The mention of the great stature of the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, in the evil report that the ten spies brought of the land of Canaan (Num 13:33) together with the LXX rendering, gigantes, suggested the translation giants. They were exceedingly wicked and violent so that "every intent" of the thoughts of men's hearts "was only evil continually" (Gen 6:5). See Merrill F. Unger, Biblical Demonology, pp. 45-52. Rephaim (ref'a-im; Heb. repa'im, "shades, ghosts"). The aboriginal giants who inhabited Canaan, Edom, Moab, and Ammon. In Abraham's time, c. 1950 BC, Chedorlaomer defeated them. At the period of the conquest, c. 1440 BC, Og, king of Bashan, is said to have alone remained of this race (Deut 3:11; Josh 12:4; 13:12). His huge bedstead of iron is mentioned in particular. Anakim (an'a-kim; Heb. anaqim, "sons of Anak"). In Num 13:33 the Anakim are classified with the Nephilim on account of their gigantic size. Emim (em'im), a race that inhabited the country of the Moabites (Gen 14:5) and that is pictured as "great, numerous, and tall as the Anakim" (Deut 2:10). Zamzummim (zam'zum-im), a giant race inhabiting the land of Ammon (Deut 2:20). Other References. From a remnant of the Anakim in Philistine Gath came the famous Goliath (1 Sam 17:4). Two of the Philistine giants are mentioned in 2 Sam 21:16-22. The tradition of a giant race persisted in the ancient Near East and goes back in the Genesis account to intercourse between fallen angels and mortal women. Although this so-called angel hypothesis of Gen 6:1-4 is disclaimed by many Bible students, it is a clear implication of the original. Says W. F. Albright, "Yahweh was believed to have created astral as well as terrestrial beings and the former were popularly called, 'the host of heaven' or 'the sons of God'. In Gen 6:1 ff., for example, . . . the (astral) gods had intercourse with mortal women who gave birth to heroes (literally, meteors, nephilim), an idea that may often be illustrated from Babylonian and Greek mythology. But the Israelite who had this section recited, unquestionably thought of intercourse between angels and women (like later Jews and Christians)" (From the Stone Age to Christianity [1940], p. 226). (From The New Unger's Bible Dictionary. Originally published by Moody Press of Chicago, Illinois. Copyright (c) 1988.) Bless you, Love Fountain |
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7 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Jesusman | 32214 | ||
Hello, Again, after several times of saying this, I have already explained this. However, I shall do so again. The Niphillim of Genesis 6:1-4 and the Niphillim of Numbers 13:33 cannot be related to one another. WHY? The Great Flood separates them. The Bible clearly says that all life on the earth, save those on the ark, was destroyed. So, the only way for the Niphillim to have survived the flood is that they were on the Ark. Therefore, either Noah and/or members of his family were niphillim, which is not supported in the Bible, or that the Niphillim were animals, which would mean again that the Niphillim of Numbers 13 are not related to the Niphillim of Genesis because Numbers is describing humans. Therefore, the term "niphillim" must be a term of description. Thus describing someone or something that is Giant in stature, fierce in actions, and has a possible tendancy to stomp on their prey or enemies. The only group I know of that would fit that description that also would've existed during the early chapters of Genesis are the Dinosaurs. Place that meaning in the passage in Genesis, along with the meaning that the mentioning of Niphillim in Genesis is to provide a time reference, you then have the author saying the the time when the "Sons of God" married the "Daughters of Men" happened when Dinosaurs where on the earth. Now, am I saying that the Niphillim of Numbers 13 are Dinosaurs also? No, the Bible clearly says that they are men. Jesus Loves You! Jesusman |
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8 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Love Fountain | 33606 | ||
Dear Jesusman, Please help me understand, Do you believe that the sons of God are always men in the Bible? Bless you, Love Fountain |
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9 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Jesusman | 33907 | ||
Hello, The meaning of any phrase is dependant upon the context in which it is used. Certain generalities can be made about a particular meaing, but the definite meaning will depend upon how it is used in it's context. Jesusman |
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10 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Love Fountain | 34254 | ||
Dear Jesusman, Thanks for the response, however you did not answer my question, so I'll ask again. Please help me understand, Do you believe that the sons of God are always men in the Bible? Bless you, Love Fountain |
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11 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Jesusman | 34274 | ||
Hello, I did answer your question. The meaning is dependant upon the context. Present the context passage, and I'll present the meaning used in that passage. Jesus Loves You! Jesusman |
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12 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Love Fountain | 35638 | ||
Dear Jesusman, In the context of the Bible is Jesus the creator of all things? Yes or No please. Bless you, Love Fountain |
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13 | The Sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 | Genesis | Jesusman | 35902 | ||
Hello, To place the context as the Bible was not what I was asking. That's like asking, "Out of all the foods across the Globe, which tastes the best?" While we may have a favorite food, we cannot objectively say that this particular food tastes the best until we have sampled every single dish from across the Globe. As for the context, I was asking for a particular passage in the Bible to examine. As I said before, the meaning of a phrase is directly dependant upon it's usage and context. Let me clarify with an example from the english language. Let's take the phrase, "I love you!" Now, if I were speaking to my girlfriend, that phrase would have a different meaning than if I were to say it to my dog, parent, or whoever. Do you see my point? From one perspective, Yes, Jesus is the Creator of all things. From the perspective that Jesus is also God in human form. However, we must also remember that the God-head consists of more than Jesus alone. There is the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Now, when examining the areas in which creation is being discussed, it is God the Father that is being focused upon, not Jesus Christ. So, from that Perspective, No, Jesus is not the creator of all things. So, the answer to your question, until you narrow it down, is "Yes and No". Jesus Loves You! Jesusman |
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