Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | how to be saved | Rom 10:9 | EdB | 74392 | ||
John I will probably regret this but...... How on earth do you justify your definition of “free will” as ability to violate physical normality’s? The American Heritage Dictionary give this definition; The mental faculty by which one deliberately chooses or decides upon a course of action, volition, A deliberate decision or conclusion. Free will is the freedom to make a choice or decision. Even though one makes that choose they may still be unable to act upon it without outside intervention. As in the case of flying I can make the choice to fly like a bird but I need a plane to do it. I may chose salvation but I still need the Holy Spirit to accomplish it. EdB |
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2 | how to be saved | Rom 10:9 | disciplerami | 74603 | ||
You know what EdB. I agree with you completely, even the part of salvation. If you have been following this thread, then you know that I believe the 'point in time' at which a person is saved is when he is immersed into Christ. I DO NOT believe in 'works' salvation, I do not believe there is any power in the water, I do not believe the person baptizing has any special power: this is why I reject the idea of baptizing infants, because they have no faith of their own. The grace of God is what saves, and he saves us through our faith. The faithless are lost. This is why there must be free will to choose salvation. Otherwise it makes God the sole determiner or who is saved. Those he gives faith to will be saved and those He doesn't give faith to will be damned. According to what JohntheReformer has been saying, the damned have been damned since birth and they stay that way by no choice of their own. According to Calvin, they inherited sin and they go to their grave with it because God did not 'elect' them. I believe in the doctrine of Election, but not in the way it is explained here on this forum page. Actually, God elected that all who would respond to the Gospel, will be saved. God is no respector of persons, He desires all men be saved, so loved the world to give all the opportunity, and his Son tasted death for (Heb.2:9). As it says in 1 John, "And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for [the sins of] the whole world." - 1 Jn. 2:2 Among the greatest of gifts we have from God is the power to choose: it makes love and faith so much more meaningful, don't you know. Anyone who talks about Calvinist election, no choice of my own type salvation, and then talks about the love of God that overlooks the 'many' going to destruction is just blowing smoke. That ain't love. My God is a God of love. He truly wants all to be saved, His fairness makes Him provide and extend it to all through the Gospel, but His righteousness forbids Him from forcing anyone to take it. All of these verses that are quoted by John with the intended effect that we are conceived with the sin of another, are actually only talking about the state of an adult sinner. The word "nature" in Ephesians 2:3 is also used in Romans 2:15 of Gentiles, who BY NATURE did the things of the Law. Our nature is not to do evil, our nature is to make choices. We do have the same nature as Adam, who being made perfect, chose to disobey God. We have that same nature, and when we sin as Adam, then death spreads to us. Good day. |
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3 | how to be saved | Rom 10:9 | EdB | 74617 | ||
disciplerami You don't agree with me completely. We are born with a sin nature. Our flesh is self centered and demanding. Watch a new born baby when it wants something it lets you know. If that behavior isn't trained out of it, as the baby grows it will become what we called spoiled brats. A small child will lie if not taught not to. They will hit or lunge out at others unless taught that is not acceptable behavior. If a baby was born with the strength of an adult it’s natural tendency would destroy anything everything around it to get with it wanted. There is no righteousness in us, it is described as filthy rags. Scriptures tells us we all sin and fall short. The word clearly states as sin entered the world through one man, and by one Man by the grace of God freed us from the curse. The difference between me and John is I believe man can learn to appreciate righteousness, just as a Baby can learn self control. I believe the Holy Spirit can/does reveal how man can obtain righteousness, showing the need for it in their life. I believe that man choose to accept or reject that offer of salvation. In that the instant man chooses salvation grace enters his life and he is saved. Since grace is at work in his life we will see righteous works become manifest in him. I believe John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.” At face value. Not with the qualifiers many want to add that “world” means a “chosen few” or elect. However to agree with me you have to also believe without the salvation provided by Jesus we were all destined to damnation. EdB |
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4 | how to be saved | Rom 10:9 | disciplerami | 74624 | ||
Greetings, I don't believe that babies and children are evil and destined for damnation. Since they can't repent, they have no chance of salvation, if that were the case. I know,...some people have come up with the answer that depraved children are held in a state of grace until they can know right and wrong, but I don't see that being taught in the Bible. David wasn't sinful at birth, his mother was, the world was, but he wasn't. I'm sure that Adam and Eve had those same impulses you describe to be sin in a baby, but they were not sinful. Being hungry isn't sinful, wanting to be held isn't sinful. It is the parents job to train their children in the way they should go in the future. They are not amenable to any law, but the law of mom and dad. I'm sure this stuff has been debated millions of times, and I know the ins and outs of your side, but can not agree with it. You know the Romans 5 passage that has been quoted about being in Adam and being in Christ. Well, if you are in Christ then you have life, if you are in Adam, then death (spiritual death is the apparent meaning since being in Christ doesn't free us of the consequences of being in this fleshly tent). But Christ'work on the cross doesn't automatically transfer men into a saved state unless men volunteerily 'take up their cross and follow Him.' The analogy also holds that men are not automatically in a lost state by virtue of physical birth, but only when they sin as Adam did. Adam was not held accountable to God as a child and neither are men today. When we are knowing right and wrong, like Adam, and choose to sin, like Adam, then death spreads to all men. Good day. |
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5 | how to be saved | Rom 10:9 | EdB | 74628 | ||
disciplerami Please don't put words in my mouth. I never said Babies are destined to damnation. I have no idea how God handles innocents that die before the age of reason. Now the babies do display an unregenerated nature that without Christ will eventually lead to their damnation should they reach the age of reason and die without accepting Jesus as Lord and Savior. Your ignoring many scriptures in your hypothesis. There is ample proof that our flesh nature is in opposition to God's nature. We think to satisfy the physical nature where God moves in the spiritual. Good day to you EdB |
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6 | how to be saved | Rom 10:9 | disciplerami | 74632 | ||
Greetings, I don't put words in your mouth, you have implied this very thing if you believe that children are born in sin. Sin is sin, those who have it a damned to hell. Now on the other hand, if they have no sin, their is no punishment. The Age of Reason: exactly when is that? Is that when they can do higher math skills and understand the virgin birth of Christ, the substitionary sacrifice of Jesus Chrsit, et al? Or is it when they can first sing "Jesus loves me.."? See, men don't know and those who believe as you do about children cloud the issue of sin and salvation. The little children puts his hand in the cookie jar, gets it slapped and is told that "God doesn't like little thieves You are going to go to hell for doing that" -- the child knew better and tried to sneak. So the child is told to confess Jesus as Savior and ask Jesus into his heart, and all is better. Is that what we call a disciple? I don't think so. No, I did not put words into your mouth because the clear implication is that children are lost if they are born in sin - just ask all of the Lutherans and Catholics and they will tell you so. Good day. Good day. |
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7 | how to be saved | Rom 10:9 | EdB | 74638 | ||
disciplerami Putting words into my mouth, If you didn't before you clearly are now. I said I do not know how God deals with innocents that die before they reach the age of reasoning. I find it hard to believe they are automatically destined for damnation. There are a couple of places that seems (and I say seems) to imply their destiny is influenced by their parents. In other words children born of pagan parents are considered pagan. However the Bible is not conclusive of that and that is why I say I do not know how God deals with innocents. Nor is there anything that conclusively supports you reasoning. As to the age of reasoning I believe it to be the age where a child can understand and fully comprehends his sin. Now I will entertain (that is not to say I agree with) the conclusion that since Jesus' death all the world's sin is forgiven, but to obtain that forgiveness we must accept Jesus as payment of that sin. In other words and I'm trying to be real careful here. One does not go to damnation because he lied, cheated, stole or killed, one goes to damnation because he rejected Jesus and His sacrifice. Under this concept and again it is not one I subscribe to, Children are born under grace until they reach an age where they can conscientiously accept or reject Jesus. However we are born with a flesh that is direct opposition to God. We resist being limited by anyone or anything including God. that is rebellion and rebellion is Sin. Please don’t read anymore into what I said than what I said. EdB |
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