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NASB | Luke 11:2 And He said to them, "When you pray, say: 'Father, hallowed be Your name. Your kingdom come. |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | Luke 11:2 He said to them, "When you pray, say: 'Father, hallowed be Your name. Your kingdom come. |
Subject: help |
Bible Note: I'm sorry but I have to offer my two cents on this. Doc, I must say, with all due respect, the manner in which you wordsmith is twisting and confusing. Your wrote: Regarding John 10 and the sheep hearing the voice of the Shepherd: This discourse is about salvation. It has nothing to say about "listening for God," nor is it establishing a normative practice for believers. I disagree with you here. It speaks of salvation yes, but it also speaks to the sovereignty of God and our response to that. It speaks of both divine sovereignty in the shepherd's call and our, “mans”, response, in hearing, knowing and the following by the sheep. It also speaks of discernment, since there are more voices calling to us than just our own shepherd's, we must be able to recognize. Following Jesus means refusing to follow others who are claiming to be shepherds. Jesus' sheep will actually run away from strangers. You wrote: "I for one am not going to limit God to how he can speak to me." I would submit, very humbly and very respectfully, ma'am, that you do limit Him. If you believe that the Scripture is not sufficient for your every need and that it is inadequate to stir the deepest delight and joy in your heart, then you are limiting God because you are not taking Him at His Word. Since God is sovereign and omnipotent He can not be limited in anything He chooses to do and that would include how He choose to identify Himself to us, whether it be in His word or in His ability to communicate otherwise. He does as He pleases. Don't rationalize His omnipotence and limit it to Scripture. You then followed that up with: Also, let me add that those who have a high view of the Scriptures are not limiting God. God has, rather, limited Himself. He is the One Who has chosen to use this vehicle to communicate to His own. Throughout history God has used many vehicles to convey his word. He spoke directly to some. In other cases He utilized the power of miracles. Sometimes His voice was a gentle whisper, other times it was a violent wind. His angels have communicated His word to us through burning bushes, the mouth of a donkey, in dreams and in revelations. And yes, the things of nature “reveal” God to us, but in order for us to recognize, they must speak to us. It may not be verbally, but rather spiritually. You say: God forbids anyone from removing or adding to His Word. Show me in His word where God tells us that is all we get? I say ask, seek and find. You also wrote: You also keep saying that God speaks in prayer. Prayer is speaking to God. It is offering thanksgiving, praise, adoration, and making supplication. Is there a Scripture that you use to derive a different meaning? Yes, prayer is speaking to God. But God answers prayers. God speaks to us in response to prayer. Now primarily, that is through the Bible, but He also speaks to our conscience by way of the Holy Spirit. It all comes down to being able to recognize His voice when He does speak. Balaam didn’t realize God was trying to communicate with him until the Lord opened his eyes. Maybe we all need to open our eyes, or rather, ask the Lord to open our eyes and we could see more clearly just how He communicates with his. (Numbers 22:28-34) Samuel heard the word of God but didn’t realize it until Eli had instructed him. (1Sam.3:1-10) Personally, God has never spoken to me, in a manner in which I could say for sure, yes that was God’s voice, but I do recognize events in which I believe He is communicating, one way or another through His Holy Spirit. He has also spoken to me through His word. However, I don’t limit His ability to communicate on any basis. How God chooses to speak to another, that is His choice and you or I have nothing to say about it. And concerning your follow up: PS Following are a few quotes that demonstrate the discomfort I have with experiences like you describe. What these folks talk about is substantively no different. If we allow for these self-validating, mystical experiences, then it opens the door for many other errors! Scripture, God’s word, does give us the means in which to identify the nature of what you call “mystical experiences”. I’ll trust God’s words over yours or any mans as authority concerning how to identify the nature of the spirits. If we shut ourselves off to God and His speaking to us and our reactions to it, then we invite the unwanted in to our lives. That opens the door far wider for errors to enter in. What is the use of praying for direction and guidance if God in return does not answer? In expecting no answer, you ask to remain in a dark, ungodly world without a guiding light whatsoever. WOS |