Results 1 - 6 of 6
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Jesus couldn't of gone up to heaven. | Luke 23:43 | FTimA | 64082 | ||
I disagree that Jesus "preached" in Hades(paradise). Hebrews 9:27 says, "And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgement..." This tells me that those souls that are in paradise either died in obedience to the old law or died in obedience to the new law. Since Jesus had just died we can't imagine that many of the converts of John the Baptist were in paradise although there may have been some. We can imagine that there were no Christians there yet because Jesus had yet to raise from the dead, ascend into heaven, and send the H.S. as a guide for the apostles, after which the first believers were converted to Christianity in Acts chapter two. Having said all of this my question would be, "What benefit would the souls in paradise realize if all they could look forward to was judgement?" Can a soul in paradise, already saved, hence the reason they are in paradise in the first place, be saved again? Jesus, I believe, bore the sins of mankind. Since God cannot tolerate sin wouldn't you think that Jesus may have spent some time on the other side of the chasm? | ||||||
2 | Jesus couldn't of gone up to heaven. | Luke 23:43 | EdB | 64085 | ||
FTimA Wow Where to start! The problem comes with the confusion of words hell and paradise. There are many words translated hell and none of them really refer to the Lake of Fire which is the judgement of the condemned. The same happens with paradise, while heaven is a paradise, paradise is not heaven. Before the death of Jesus (Old Testament) when people died they went to Hades/Sheol. This was the holding place for the dead. In this holding place there was two sides a hot dry side and Abraham’s Bosom/Paradise. We see this described in Luke 16:19-31. The hot dry side contained those that rejected God’s offer of a Messiah and salvation, being in rebellion to God, they are the condemned. Everyone, both Old Testament and New Testament, that dies condemned goes to the hot dry place to await final judgement at the Great White Throne of Judgement seen in Rev 20:11-15. Before Jesus’ death (Old Testament) everyone that died looking for redemption went to Abraham’s bosom (Paradise) and waited for their salvation. These were not yet saved but rather people that died believing God’s promise to provide a savior. There is no salvation outside of Jesus. Jesus clearly taught that No man comes to the Father but by Jesus. Therefore they weren’t looking for judgement they were looking for the promised Messiah. Read Hebrews 11. Upon Jesus’ death he descended in to Hades. To Abraham’s Bosom/Paradise side and preached the “Good News” and lead the captivity captive to heaven. Eph 4:8. Now when a saved person (New Testament) dies he goes directly into the presence of the Lord Paul teaches this in 2 Cor. 5:8. The final resting place for the condemned is not Hades/Hell but the Lake of Fire Rev 20:15. The final place for the Redeemed is not heaven per se but rather the New Jerusalem in the presence of the Lord which will be heaven! The scripture you quoted Hebrews 9:27 is a scripture to refute reincarnation. It is saying we only live once upon this earth. Our life is then judged and our end is decided by whether we accepted Jesus as Lord and Master or died in rebellion to God’s word. I pray I was able to help you better understand this. This subject has been extensively discussed in the past and you may want to do a search, using the quick search box over on the right. EdB |
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3 | Jesus couldn't of gone up to heaven. | Luke 23:43 | prayon | 64179 | ||
Greetings Ed, I believe that those who have never heard the name Jesus will also go to Abrahams busom. We know that no one can enter the kingdom without first our Lord and Savior. Those who have not heard of Jesus can not be responsible for what they do not know. So I think that these people will be waiting in Abraham's bosum for Jesus to let them know who He is. prayon | ||||||
4 | Jesus couldn't of gone up to heaven. | Luke 23:43 | Reformer Joe | 64183 | ||
But they do know... "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse." --Romans 1:18-20 --Joe! |
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5 | Jesus couldn't of gone up to heaven. | Luke 23:43 | prayon | 64247 | ||
If I understand you correctly you are saying that there is no one who does not know Jesus? The verse says that God holds all men responsible for what he has shown of himself in creation. These men have had an opportunity to see the clear witness about the character and existance of God through divine revelation. There are a lot of people who know this but have not accepted Jesus, they don't even know there is a Jesus. Those who have accepted the revelation but have not heard the gospel are the ones who will be in Abrahams busom. They will hear of Jesus in Abraham's busom and will then have an opportunity to accept Him at that time. John 14:6 "No one come to the Father except through me". Those who have never heard the gospel have to hear of Jesus or they can't get to the Father. prayon |
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6 | Jesus couldn't of gone up to heaven. | Luke 23:43 | Reformer Joe | 64283 | ||
You wrote: "If I understand you correctly you are saying that there is no one who does not know Jesus?" No, what Romans 1 teaches is that no one is unaware of God the Father. Atheists are lying to themselves, in other words. The existence and attributes of God are part of what is commonly called "general revelation." The first part of Psalm 19 testifies to this general revelation as well. "Those who have accepted the revelation but have not heard the gospel are the ones who will be in Abrahams busom." Where do you get from this passage that ANYONE accepted the revelation? What Paul describes in Romans 1 is a universal rejection and suppression of the truth of God. Read Romans 1:28-32. These people did not acknowledge God, and even though God's general revelation even points out that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them, but give approval to those who do. The gospel fall under the category of "special revelation." Abraham didn't seek God; God revealed Himself to Abraham. Likewise, God chose to reveal Himself to Moses in the burning bush. Everyone is condemned for rejecting the general revelation of God in nature and in the conscience (made plain to all, as Romans 1 tells us), but the message of salvation (the gospel contained in the Scriptures) is revealed specially. "They will hear of Jesus in Abraham's busom and will then have an opportunity to accept Him at that time." What Scripture passage supports this statement? Hebrews 9:27 seems to contradict it. We need to be careful not to thrust our own wishful thinking upon what God has revealed. "Those who have never heard the gospel have to hear of Jesus or they can't get to the Father." I agree, which is why God in His sovereignty has made our obedience in proclaiming the gospel a key element in His overall plan of redemption: "How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher?" --Romans 10:14 The implied answer to all of these questions is, "They won't." People will not call on the Lord is they have not believed. People will not believe if they have not heard. People will not hear unless they are preached to. In other words, those who do not hear the gospel (and are condemned by their rejection of God the Father) go to hell. --Joe! |
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