Results 1 - 10 of 10
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | John Reformed | 36082 | ||
Dear Jesusman, To answer your question: "How can a sovreign God, with the power to create the universe, raise the dead, and be able to "elect" who he wills to be saved, not be able to "elect" all of mankind? It is not a question of God's ability for He does as he wants concerning the affairs of men. Rather, it is a question of; What is God's good pleasure. Dan: 4:35 "All the inhabitants of the earth are accounted as nothing, But He does according to His will in the host of heaven And among the inhabitants of earth; Ro 9: 22-24: "who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this, will it? Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use? What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction? And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory,even us, whom He also called, not from among Jews only, but also from among Gentiles. Your Fellow Pot, John What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction? And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for even us, whom He also called, not from among Jews only, but also from |
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2 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | Jesusman | 36233 | ||
Hello, So, then your point is that God is like some cosmic Nero, laughing at the torment and pain he is putting others through when he has every chance and ability to stop it? God has the ability to do as he wills to do. In fact, the Bible states that it is God's will that all men be saved. Why doesn't he just come right out and do it? Jesusman |
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3 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | John Reformed | 36263 | ||
Dear Jesusman, Do you not see that your outraged reply: "So, then your point is that God is like some cosmic Nero, laughing at the torment and pain he is putting others through when he has every chance and ability to stop it?", is the very thing Paul anticipated from those who would object to his teaching? I submit to you my following commentary, which may serve to further your understanding of why I believe what I believe. I would sincerely appreciate any comments or critisisms of this this admittedly humble attempt. Paul begins Chapter 9 of Romans by declaring the veracity of his teaching. He then assures his audience of his desperate love for his Jewish bretheren. Even to his willingness to suffer the agony of eternal damnation in their place. He extols their rich religious heritage. The apostle then explains the reason why, despite their apparent abandonment by God, the promise to Abraham has not been broken. He explains that the promised seed is not a carnal seed, in that not all of Abrahams decendents are considered children of Israel. He uses the twin sons of Isaac and Rebecca to illustrate God's plan to save a people of His own choosing. Rom 9:13 "JACOB I LOVED, BUT ESAU I HATED." Paul realizes that this statement flys in the face of man's stubborn insistance on retaing control of their own lives. He anticipates their reaction and seeks to nip it in the bud. Rom 9:14 "What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there? May it never be!". In support of his teaching he brings the witness of the Scripture (Ro 9:16-18). Again he knows what their outraged reaction will be by stating it in v.19 " You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?". Paul brings them up short by reminding them of their status as living beings "who are you, O man, who answers back to God?". They are mere creatures, how dare they protest their Creator's purpose. The only rights they have are the ones he provides them. Paul is brutal in his honesty to the protester. He knocks the pins out from the vain idea of self-determination. No, No, No. God determines who will be His and who will not be His. He Chose Israel but did not choose all of Israel, He chose Jacob but rejected Esau. He is the potter, we are the clay! This particular chapter (Romans 9) is as clear as a bell. God has taken care to spell out the unavoidable truth That "who are you, O man, who answers back to God?". Your Brother in Christ, John |
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4 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | Jesusman | 36724 | ||
Hello, Ok. Paul makes it clear that God does as he chooses. That still doesn't answer the next question. If it is God's spoken desire that all of mankind are to be saved, and that he has the very power and ability to do so, then Why doesn't he do it? What is stopping him from saving all of mankind? Jesusman |
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5 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | John Reformed | 36760 | ||
Dear Jesusman, I'm sure that you are more than familiar with Paul's response to that very question. However I have provided it anyway. Rom 9:22,23 "What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory,". I would appreciate your reply at your earliest convenience. You have certainly aroused my curiosity. Your Friend, John |
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6 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | Jesusman | 37821 | ||
Hello, I apologize for taking so long to respond. I didn't realize that you had replied yet. So It is God's will that all should be saved, and it is his will that some should experience his wrath? That doesn't appear to be consistant. Believe me that I am not advocating universal salvation and the idea that all will go to heaven. Jesus clearly teaches that not all will go to Heaven and many will go to Hell. I'm questioning the thought that God alone decides who goes to Heaven and Hell. It appears as though there is another factor involved. It's as if there is something apart from God that is inhibiting him from saving all of mankind. In Romans 1:18-32, it is clear that Mankind is responsible for their own individual actions, that God has revealed himself, and that God continues to do so even today. In this passage, God punishes them for their actions, which ultimately leads to Hell. Both the Sinner and God play an intricate part together down the road to Hell. The Sinner sins, and God punishes them for it. Now, when we turn to salvation, we find that God takes over all control, Man becomes an apparent robot or puppet, and the others are left out in the cold, or heat as it were. That is confusing to me. Why would there be a union of equal actions between God and the Sinner, and a lack of such between God and the Saved? Jesusman |
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7 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | John Reformed | 37853 | ||
Dear Bruce, God was not and is not obliged to save anyone. But because He is merciful, He chose to save some and pass by the rest. God in the person of the Holy Spirit, goes to The Fathers chosen (Elect; those of the promise) and regenerates their fallen nature by the gracious gift of faith. This new creation opens his eyes and recognizes his sinfulness, repents and falls on his knees beseeching Christ for salvation. The reprobate are left to pursue the desires of their own wicked hearts. This is hard for us to accept. Nevertheless it is what the Bible teaches, cover to cover. Would a man be so bold as to summon God Almighty before the court of human reason and try Him for being injust. "Why did you make me this way?" It would be akin to a criminal trying a judge. I was deeply distressed upon being disabused of my own "free will fantasy". It does't seem fair I cried. But where else could I go. It was impossible for me to walk away from Christ. He is the only one who has the words of eternal life. In the end I humbled myself and surrendered to the clear teaching of Scripture. Godgave me a promise to sustain me during times of darkness and unbelief that lay ahead: Gen 18:25 "Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?" The good news is that which was once bitter has become sweet. I rejoice in His Judgements and rest securely in His soverign rule over the earth and over my life. God Bless Bruce, John |
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8 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | Jesusman | 37859 | ||
Hello, You said: "God was not and is not obliged to save anyone. But because He is merciful, He chose to save some and pass by the rest." My reply: The question I must reply with is: Is this in accordance to God's stated Law? You said: "God in the person of the Holy Spirit, goes to The Fathers chosen (Elect; those of the promise) and regenerates their fallen nature by the gracious gift of faith. This new creation opens his eyes and recognizes his sinfulness, repents and falls on his knees beseeching Christ for salvation." My reply: So then, it isn't Man having faith in God? It's God having faith in Man? Is this biblical? You Said: "This is hard for us to accept. Nevertheless it is what the Bible teaches, cover to cover. Would a man be so bold as to summon God Almighty before the court of human reason and try Him for being injust. "Why did you make me this way?" It would be akin to a criminal trying a judge." My reply: So, God judges who he chooses and has mercy on who he chooses? Let me set up the situaion as it appears. We have God choosing who will and who will not be saved. We have the Holy Spirit going to those who have been chosen to recieve Salvation. We also have that only those who have been touched by the Holy Spirit will be Saved. Now, at the final judgement we have two people standing before God. One who was chosen to be saved, and the other who was not chosen to be saved. The Saved can go on into Heaven. However, the one who was not CHosen has every right to stand before God and say that it is God's fault that this person will go to Hell, not his own. The requirement for entering Heaven is whether or not you have been saved. This person had no chance to be saved. The Holy Spirit never approached him, nor was he offered the chance. So, the responcibility of this person's actions does not fall upon the Person himself, but upon God. Therefore, God is not Just. Do you see my point? If you are to follow Calvinism theology to it's natural, and logical conclusion, that is what you get. That is also why I disagree with calvinism to a degree. The Bible teaches that God is completely Just. To be Just, the Holy Spirit must approach every person with the opportunity for Salvation at least once. God, being Holy and righteous, is also bound to his stated word, which includes the Law. Therefore, Salvation must also comply with the Law as well as the New Testament. As Calvinism describes Salvation, it doesn't comply. Jesusman |
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9 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | Hank | 37863 | ||
Jesusman, there are some pesty verses of Scripture that I have trouble trying to fit into the scheme of some theological systems. For example, 2 Peter 3:9. Oh, I am aware of the attempts to argue around it, but they fall short of conviction with me. --Hank | ||||||
10 | Bad Arguments Against Calvinism | John 15:16 | Jesusman | 37865 | ||
Hello Hank, I take it that you see my point? Simply put, The Bible is coherent, inerrant, and logical. True, there maybe areas that are hard to grasp in reality, but it makes sense overall. Our doctrine should reflect that as much as possible. I don't want to say too much more in fear that it may jeapordize the rest I have to say in relation to this. I'm going to wait until John replies. Jesus Loves You! Jesusman |
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