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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Submissive or Suppressed Wills | Luke 22:42 | mark d seyler | 166610 | ||
Hi WOS, After considering the Scriptures that seem to apply to this question, mulling this over for a few days, and bouncing some things around, these are the conclusion I have come to. Following the work of regeneration, we respond in our "new creation" spirit to God in submission. We are identified with the new creature, not with the old, so when we speak of the person we are who is responding, it is the new creation. 2 Cor 5 16 From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer. 17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. The new creation is in right relationship with God. Eph 4:24 and to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness. (I am using for brevity's sake only a small portion of the applicable passages.) We willingly submit to His Lordship. This is axiomatic to a right relationship with Him. Romans 8, and a host of other verses show us this. Since we yield to Him, there is no suppression of our will required. I do not find any Scriptures that speak of us forcefully subjected to God's will. That is reserved for the unbelievers, who will, at the end, submit. All such passages relating to the believer seem to me to be calling us to submit, and to cooperate with the work of sanctification. The old nature, however, is another story. While sanctification, like regeneration, is clearly the Lord's work in us, Heb 2:11 For he who sanctifies and those who are sanctified all have one origin. That is why he is not ashamed to call them brothers, Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, Eph 5:26 that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, yet I see over and over instructions that we are to actively follow, resulting in the suppression of the old nature. Col 3:5 Put to death therefore what is earthly in you Rom 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord. Rom 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. These all speak of an action that happens to the flesh. The flesh does not submit. It is dead, and is to be treated as dead. When it tries to exert its own will, it is to be reckoned as dead, and put to death. So I will answer that as regenerate believers, we respond with submission of our will to God, while suppressing the old nature. Again, I will be interested in your thoughts on this. Great topic! Love in Christ, Mark |
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2 | Submissive or Suppressed Wills | Luke 22:42 | Wild Olive Shoot | 167095 | ||
Brother Mark, After contemplating this for some time, I must say, it seems to get more confusing the more one tries to understand. We know God is the “mechanism” behind regeneration and our response is in faith. I believe Scripture is clear on those two points. The intricacies however, though maybe important, aren’t necessary for us to identify and therefore aren’t spelled out to us in specific terms. John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. Here is what I can come up with concerning the regenerate and their will at and after regeneration. This was not an exhaustive look and my points mentioned below are only to help in answering my original thoughts: (We are predestined to be called): Romans 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, (We are regenerated by wholly an act of God with no assistance from ourselves): Romans 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. (Because prior to regeneration we lack any moral agent enabling us to desire anything from God): Romans 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. 12They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. (We receive a new nature): Ephesians 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) 2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. (With this new nature we are free to believe the Gospel): 1 John 5:1Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. 1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life. (We receive faith, upon regeneration, a gift from God): 1 Corinthians 12:8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; 9To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; (Faith is our response and with that faith, we freely desire God’s will): John 3:21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God. I agree, I see no forceful suppression by God on the regenerate. I see a new nature given that was not previously an occupant within us. To paraphrase Hendryx, Grace makes us willing to respond. As our hearts are changed or made anew, we respond in faith. God enables our will, forgoing suppression, and acts on it in such a way that causes us to willfully yield. We are responsive in as far as we willingly turn to faith in Christ in which previously, this desire did not exist within us and therefore we were unable. A new nature is given, therefore, suppression is not necessarily a factor since our minds, wills and hearts now are fully able, and desirous of, submitting to God, in faith. “God disarms the opposition of the human heart, subduing the hostility of the carnal mind, and with irresistible power (John 6:37, 63-65), draws His chosen ones to Christ.” – John Hendryx All of that to say, I agree with what you have posted and don’t believe I could have conveyed it as accurately as you have. Thanks Mark (and Doc) for helping me to work my way through these thoughts. Matthew 19:25When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved? 26But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible. WOS |
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3 | Submissive or Suppressed Wills | Luke 22:42 | DocTrinsograce | 167099 | ||
All I can say is "WOW WOS!" :-) Very well done and very well thought through. Thank you for sharing! | ||||||