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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | help | Luke 11:2 | DocTrinsograce | 149316 | ||
Dear Sister Bows44, Thank you for answering my queries! I apologize if you interpreted them as contentious. I'll try to answer your questions. You wrote, "How can talking with him not be exciting? (sic)" I agree! Communing with God is more important than life itself. Even the times when His incredible holiness drives us to our knees in the recognition of our utter inadequacy and sinfulness, it is still an awesome and incredible thing! He is the lover our soul, has elected us unto salvation, has purchased our redemption by the shed blood of His Son, has sealed us with His Holy Spirit, etc. Frankly, if a person does not love the Lord, then they do not know Him (1 Cor 16:22). Hence my concern for the person you were attempting to encourage. You wrote, "Are you saying that God is limited to speaking to his sheep through the Bible only?" Yes. God does not speak through nature. (Some of His attributes are revealed there.) God does not speak through animals. (Even in Num 22, it was the donkey speaking.) Insofar as "others, songs, and experiences," I would say that is true if they reflect the Word of God. God forbids anyone from removing or adding to His Word (Rev 22:18 and elsewhere). Even Peter states that the Scriptures are superior to the experience he had on the mount of transfiguration (2 Peter 1:19)! By the way, you mentioned many of the attributes of Satan but you left out an important one. In fact, it is clear from the very first instance we see him in Scripture. Satan deceives! (John 8:44) Also, "Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light" (2 Cor 11:14b). Regarding John 10 and the sheep hearing the voice of the Shepherd: This discourse is about salvation. It has nothing to say about "listening for God," nor is it establishing a normative practice for believers. You also keep saying that God speaks in prayer. Prayer is speaking to God. It is offering thanksgiving, praise, adoration, and making supplication. Is there a Scripture that you use to derive a different meaning? You wrote, "Would you want a one sided conversation with them (family)? Have you written down everything you have to say to them and had it compiled into a book and told them that is all you have to say? Isn't talking with your wife and kids exciting or enjoyable?" The answers are: No. No. and Yes. This always puzzles me. The Word of God is living, not just "a book." It is vibrant, alive, deep, convicting, rich, etc. It puzzles me that there are believers who think that the Bible is inadequate. Isn't the doctrine of the sufficiency of Scripture taught in your church? You wrote, "I for one am not going to limit God to how he can speak to me." I would submit, very humbly and very respectfully, ma'am, that you do limit Him. If you believe that the Scripture is not sufficient for your every need and that it is inadequate to stir the deepest delight and joy in your heart, then you are limiting God because you are not taking Him at His Word. I am only a simple, inadequate servant of the Lord, so please do not be offended. The Pharisees depended on the oral traditions more than the Scriptures. They said, "It is said..." and Christ always said, "It is written..." If Christ Himself put such emphasis on the Scriptures, how can we not do the same? Also, let me add that those who have a high view of the Scriptures are not limiting God. God has, rather, limited Himself. He is the One Who has chosen to use this vehicle to communicate to His own. You wrote, "I love my Jesus and he loves me and we enjoy hanging out together and talking. I would that every Christian develop a passionate relationship with Jesus." Again, I humbly suggest that this is a presumptuous statement. I have a deep, abiding, satisfying, exciting, and fulfilling relationship with the Lord. He speaks great volumes to me directly from the Word. However, Christianity is not about joy, peace, excitement, experiences, etc. It is about the Truth. Job said, "Though He slay me, yet shall I serve Him." We serve the Lord not for what we get out of it, but because of Who He is! In Him, Doc |
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2 | help | Luke 11:2 | Bows44 | 149348 | ||
Hi Doc..just a few responses from your post. Frankly, if a person does not love the Lord, then they do not know Him (1 Cor 16:22). Hence my concern for the person you were attempting to encourage. - It was my understanding this person was saved already and looking for a more meaningful prayer life. What I did was stear him to Jesus, encouraging him to listen as well as talk. Many times what God says is other scriptures. You wrote: God does not speak through nature. God does not speak through animals. Depends on what one means by speaking through nature. Some examples from my life: 1. Once I was facing a temptation. One morning during this tempatation period I was spending time with God while walking around my backyard, drinking my morning cup of coffee. I walked into a spider web and quickly shook it off. I immediately heard God say, "As easy as you shook off this spider web, so you shall shake off this temptation." This encouraged me and I was indeed able to resist (shake) it off. 2. I had a dog named Guard Dog. Last year she passed away at the age of 16. When she was 15, she developed a large cancerous tumor on her spleen. I asked God to spare her because she absolutely loved my other dog Pumpkin who we were planning on breeding. I wanted Guard Dog who was such a mothering type to be able to see the puppies. God graciously guided the vet's hands and Guard Dog survived. A year later the puppies were born. On July 5, 2004 she died in the place that the day before she had laid in and watched the puppies play. That day we went to my inlaws 2 hours drive away. The Lord spoke to me and told me that she was going to die that day. I couldn't change our plans, so God said to just be sure to get home in time to bury her. So we did. On the way home, as we came into our town (which is very small) we saw three rainbows. God was speaking comfort to us through those rainbows. Reminding us of his promises and goodness. 3.) Every time I see my puppies, I hear God say, "I care. I love you. You are my beloved child in whom I am well pleased." Those puppies are a blessing from God. 4.) God uses my dogs to remind me to show my son the same grace and mercy and consistancy and unconditional love that I show them. I could give many more examples of how God uses animals and nature to speak to me. But time and space to not permit. If it is scriptural proof you want, see Romans 1:20. We can know God by looking at creation a.k.a. nature. It "speaks" of who God is so man is without excuse. You said: Regarding John 10 and the sheep hearing the voice of the Shepherd: This discourse is about salvation. It has nothing to say about "listening for God," nor is it establishing a normative practice for believers. Well, God talked to Abraham, Moses, Joshua, and (if we believe the scriptures are inspired by the Holy Spirit) he also talked to everyone who wrote parts of the Bible. Everyone of these he talked to heard him. That's called listening. Why wouldn't he talk to us today? And if he is, then we are expected to listen and hear. God doesn't change. The same way he talked to them, he'll talk to us. The apostles had scriptures too, called the Torah, the Prophets, Psalms and Proverbs. I'm sure that the Pharisees didn't approve of their writings as scripture, yet we do so today. I guess we should just burn every book written by Christians since the Bible was compiled since according to what you are saying that would be adding to scripture and God doesn't speak through anything but validated scripture. But wait...let's read that scripture again.. REv 22:18 I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues which are written in this book; This was written BEFORE the Bible was compiled. Actually this is talking about only the Book of Revelation. So I guess we can keep the books after all, because God does give us more understanding (revelation) of scripture and who he is and who we are and what he wants us to do. You asked: Isn't the doctrine of the sufficiency of Scripture taught in your church? No. We are taught in the sufficiency of Jesus. We don't worship a book. We worship God as Jesus Christ, the only begotton son of God, the Heavenly Father and the Holy Spirit. Regarding scripture, we are taught that it is the inerrant Word of God and that we are to study it and meditate on it and use it to teach, reprove and train others with. It is one of our weapons of warfare. All revelation must be in agreement with scripture. I'll address your last paragraph in another post, since this one is getting a bit long. |
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3 | help | Luke 11:2 | DocTrinsograce | 149357 | ||
Dear Bows44, Thank you for taking the time to respond so fully. It is much appreciated. Although your experiences are interesting, they are not persuasive. Many folks have had lots of experiences, resulting in the false religions of the world. This forum emphasizes the authority of the Bible over experience. I do not intend any note of irony when I state that this is why the forum is a StudyBibleForum rather than a StudyExperienceForum. We seek to found all we say on Scripture. Regarding Rom 1:20 as evidence for "God using nature to speak to us," I can understand what you are saying if you use a broad definition for "speak." However, that could be very misleading, especially to the world. As the old scholars put it "Although the light of nature, and the works of creation and providence do so far manifest the goodness, wisdom, and power of God, as to leave men inexcusable; yet are they not sufficient to give that knowledge of God and his will which is necessary unto salvation." Note they do not call this "speaking." In fact, I can find no reputable Bible scholar who does so. Speaking infers an effort to communicate. We know some about God because of things He has done, but not all of the things He does are communication. If you look at my lawn you would see that I mowed it yesterday. From this you can infer things about me. However, I was not "speaking" anything by the act of mowing! Although the following does not address the incorrect hermeneutic of John 10, I will respond. You wrote, "Well, God talked to Abraham, Moses, Joshua, and ... he also talked to everyone who wrote parts of the Bible. Everyone of these he talked to heard him. (sic)" That is correct. As has been noted in Heb 1:1 "In many ways and in various ways of old, God spoke to the fathers in the prophets." Note it does not say God spoke to the fathers through nature, experience, feelings, or voices. Nor does it say God spoke to you or me. God spoke to the fathers. You asked, "Why wouldn't he talk to us today?" Many things happened in history. Many people lived and died. God chose about 40 of them to pen the Scriptures. If you question is why God doesn't speak to you the same way, that is because He has chosen you to live in the world here and now. He has not granted that you be one of the prophets of Scripture. If you are asking why God does not have prophets writing more today, it is because He no longer uses that method. Please read Hebrews 1:2, "in these last days spoken unto us by His Son." You wrote, "The apostles had scriptures too, called the Torah, the Prophets, Psalms and Proverbs." Yes, they did. Again, I point to 2 Peter where he (an apostle) places the authority of Scripture higher than experience. You wrote, "I'm sure that the Pharisees didn't approve of their writings as scripture, yet we do so today." Ma'am, no offense, but this comment demonstrates you do not understand who and what the Pharisees were. I suggest further study. (It was the Sadducees who had the low view of Scripture.) In fact, Christ was critical of the Pharisees, as they had the Scriptures, but placed something else in higher authority. I agree that there are many "Christian" books that ought to be burned. I'd start with several that are currently being sold at Wal-Mart! From your comments, however, I suspect you misunderstood what I meant by "adding to Scripture." It means saying something that God did not say and attributing it to Him. In ancient Israel, anyone doing that was called a false prophet. It was such a serious offense that such people were killed immediately. I mentioned Revelation 22 in my post to Wild Olive Branch. You answered my questions about the teaching the sufficiency of Scripture in your church with, "No. We are taught in the sufficiency of Jesus." I commend you to John chapter 1. Jesus is the Word of God. You wrote, "We don't worship a book." This must be a common theme in AG circles as it comes up so often. It is a terrible misrepresentation. (If you wish to condemn, please condemn on our own merits, not something we do not affirm! That's a logical fallacy that reveals more about the person using it than the one with whom they are debating.) This is like someone saying "Pentecostals worship the 'gifts of the Spirit.'" Shouldn't we place the same significance on Scripture that God places on it? "I will worship toward Thy holy temple, and praise Thy Name for Thy loving kindness and for Thy Truth: for Thou hast magnified Thy Word above all Thy Name." Were you aware that God placed such a high value on the Word? In Him, Doc |
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