Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | 2 Corinthians- What is 'suffering' | 2 Cor 1:5 | gracefull | 80564 | ||
"There has been much debate on the exact nature of the thorn, of course, but there are a few things that we can be certain of:" There is no room here for debate...scripture is clear..messnger(angel) from Satan.so unless you can say Cancer is an angel from Satan inflicting, there can be no debate...I can see THAT being preached from a pulpit! The messenger is not some illusive word in which you can pick and choose an convenient alternative. "While it was from Satan, it is also true to say it was given by God, since the purpose was to keep Paul from exalting Himself. Satan's purpose is never to humble us before God our Father." Given by God and allowed by God are totally different. Scripture says it was a messenger(angel) FROM Satan. Scripture does not say "from God". God simply did not 'remove' it AND told Paul why! But again...since it "One more note on sickness: Paul praises Epaphroditus as an example of Godly faith in Philippians 2 for sacrificing himself for the cause of Christ in spite of his life-threatening illness." You see 'Paul did not criticize him for lack of faith...' The subject here is not judgementalism. Paul did praise him for his Godly faith in continuing in service despite the sickness in his body and secondly God healed him. The subject is God's will to heal. God healed Epaphroditus... "So whether we are talking about sickness or not, God ordains that uncomfortable, unhappy, and dangerous things happen to His children for His glory. Why someone would simply cut sickness out of that list of uncomfortable, unhappy, and dangerous things doesn't make a lot of sense." By leaving Satan in service...active in the earth..believers will experience great challenges,persections and troubles and as Paul said we have Jesus's encouragement and deliverance... It makes no sense to me and is even wrong to ADD it when it is not there. Remember these are scriptures used to enforce the teaching that sickness is from God to teach us. Only when altered do they substantiate this doctrine. To state that suffering 'should' include sickness and desease is to disagree with what the scripture and the Greek translations state. IN CONTEXT Paul is speaking of suffering as persecutions, and troubles or obstacles...and is not speaking concerning sickness and desease. 1Peter 2:24 The Stone of stumbling... He himself bore our sins in His body on the stake, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness-by His wounds you were healed. Wounds-Strongs #2390 cure, heal, make whole Also used in Matthew 8:8 Matthew 8:13 Mark 5:29 Luke 6:19 Acts 3:11 And many more scriptures pertaining to PHYSICAL HEALING. I am disappointed that in light of these truths, you choose to continue to defend an interpretation of these scriptures that has been created by religion to 'comfort' rather than teach truth, WHEN TRUTH IS THE ULTIMATE COMFORT. God bless |
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2 | 2 Corinthians- What is 'suffering' | 2 Cor 1:5 | Morant61 | 80586 | ||
Greetings Graceful! I firmly believe that God heals. I have seen blinded eyes opened. I have seen broken bones mended immediately. Now, if it is ALWAYS God's will to heal, why did my son die of congential heart defects? Why was he born with them? I prayed day and night for him! Many others were also praying for him, yet he still died at 9 months old - after 9 months of sickness. The church we attended at the time also taught this doctrine that it is always God's will to heal. The comment made to us afterwards was that we simply did not have enough faith. I love you my friend, but this doctrine is simply not true. It makes every Christian who has ever been ill to somehow be deficit in faith. It makes every Christian who has ever died of cancer to be somehow deficit in faith. It makes every Christian family who has ever had a miscarriage or a terminally ill child to be somehow deficit in faith. Please show me the verse which plainly states that it is always God's will to heal sickness! The problem I have with this doctrine is twofold. 1) First of all, it is not Scriptural. There isn't any verse which states that God will always heal. I read an article on the web site you recommended the other day, and that authors main arguement was that since God is no respector of persons, if He heals anyone, He must heal everyone. 2) Secondly, it makes a mockery of the geninue faith of those who serve God in spite of sickness. What my family went through made us stronger. It made our faith stronger. It was not a sign of a lack of faith. Those who lose a child and continue to serve God do not have weak faith! :-) Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | 2 Corinthians- What is 'suffering' | 2 Cor 1:5 | gracefull | 80749 | ||
I too, love you Tim...I find your graceful responses and your knowledge quite enlightening. I choose to only offer my heartfelt compassion for the grief you and your family experienced. God bless |
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4 | 2 Corinthians- What is 'suffering' | 2 Cor 1:5 | Morant61 | 80771 | ||
Greetings Graceful! Thanks for the kind words my friend! I want to stress that I am not upset with you in anyway! These events happened a long time ago. However, these are the kinds of questions and situations that Christians face everyday. And, these are the kinds of emotions that this doctrine will provoke. Every Christian who experience illness or death in his family will be made to feel like second rate believers. I firmly believe that God heals, and I believe that He would heal more if we actually believed that He wants to heal. However, there simply isn't any Scripture which indicates that it is always God's will to heal. Faith is not some magic power which gets us whatever we want in life. Faith is our trust or confidence in God no matter what the cirumstances of life. It is those, who like Joni Tada Erickson, who can serve God joyfully even with physical problems who truely have faith. It is those like Corrie Ten Boom, who can love God even in the midst of horrors like the Holocost (sp?), who truely have faith. So, I do urge you to consider the impact that this doctrine has one those in the churches. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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5 | 2 Corinthians- What is 'suffering' | 2 Cor 1:5 | gracefull | 80778 | ||
Tim, I can't compare experience with scripture...if they differ even when it does not seem 'right'in my own understanding. God bless |
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6 | 2 Corinthians- What is 'suffering' | 2 Cor 1:5 | Morant61 | 80783 | ||
Greetings Graceful! I'm not sure I understood your statement correctly. I think you were saying that Scriture trumps experience. :-) I would agree. However, I don't believe that Scripture teaches that it is always God's will to heal. So, I'm not saying that we should change the teachings of Scripture to please people. I am saying though that we should be careful not to wound people by teaching as a doctrine something which is not taught by Scripture. I went to one of the web sites you recommended and read their defense of this doctrine. Frankly, it was very shaking. :-) The whole argument was based upon assumptions and casual statements, like the greeting in 3 John 2. There really wasn't any Scriptural support for this doctrine. Perhaps, if you are willing, you could lay out your case! Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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7 | 2 Corinthians- What is 'suffering' | 2 Cor 1:5 | gracefull | 80784 | ||
Tim, if 3 John 2 were all there was, I would agree with you totally.. but that is not it. I am not prepared to attempt to go over all of why I believe today, and may not put it here on the forum in any 'lump sum' formula. Perhaps when I post on the subject again, you will join in the Bible study. God bless |
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