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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | What was Jesus doing in the earth 3 days | Matthew | Radioman2 | 93621 | ||
JESUS IN HELL? ...JOYCE MEYER ____________________ "Strange how first-class, super-Christians, who would have us believe they are tapping into divine revelation, can do all things in Christ, except successfully defend their damnable doctrines of demons." ____________________ 'The Charisma article indicates that another of Meyer’s critics, apologist Hank Hanegraaff, cited her booklet, The Most Important Decision You Will Ever Make.8 Hanegraaff faulted Meyer for teaching that Jesus was born again in hell. Meyer responded by stating that she does not believe and has never taught that particular doctrine. 'Whether Hanegraaff ever used the exact words, “Jesus was born again in hell” or if the Charisma writer simply put those words in the Southern California apologist’s mouth in an attempt to build a “straw man” is not clear. What is clear, however, in spite of Meyer’s denials, is that in the fourth chapter of her booklet, The Most Important Decision You Will Ever Make, she: '• Teaches a born again Jesus.9 '• Teaches that hell, not the cross, is where salvation was purchased.10 'She not only delineates and defines the heresy but she blatantly defends it. 'While Meyer may deny now that she has ever taught that “Jesus was born again in hell,” she has not renounced the teaching nor denounced those who teach it. Were she to do so, she most likely would neither have her picture in or on Charisma magazine again, nor would she be invited to speak with the heretics who do believe and teach it: her mentors and friends. 'Based on the content of her book, turning to Christ would be the most impotent decision one would ever make. By placing faith in “another Jesus” (2 Corinthians 11:4) as put forth in her booklet, a new “believer” would not be entitled to the new covenant purchased with Jesus Christ’s blood. Rather, the Jesus that Meyer proclaims, is a Jesus whose blood paid for nothing because his “blood was made of no effect,” being “treated as an unholy thing” (Hebrews 10:29), because according to this teaching, Jesus’ payment was actually made by suffering in hell. This teaching makes the “It is finished” of John 19:30 a lie. First Corinthians 15:3 is very clear: “Jesus was crucified and died for our sins,” not suffered in hell for our sins. 'Thus, Meyer refuses to debate and will not “comment directly on such opposition.” Is it any wonder that her husband remarked, “We let God respond” and “That’s not our position, to try and come back and straighten them out”? 'As noted above, neither Meyer nor her husband has the necessary theological training to defend her indefensible teachings. The only reason the Meyers can say that it’s not their “position” to respond and “straighten” us out is that they fail to grasp the basics of biblical interpretation and hermeneutics. As a result, it’s not that they won’t respond, it’s because they cannot respond. “Let[ting] God respond” is merely subterfuge. Strange how first-class, super-Christians, who would have us believe they are tapping into divine revelation, can do all things in Christ, except successfully defend their damnable doctrines of demons. 'As we read earlier, the Apostle Paul’s attitude was not to just let God respond, but to get into the trenches and do what God called him to do, namely to “cut the ground from under those who proclaim” another gospel. 'Even worse, their response gives this issue the sense of unimportance. Much to do about nothing! If it were, we would truly be wasting their time. Yet, those in apologetics ministries are keenly aware that this is an essential issue. Corrupting the Gospel produces heretical and damnable doctrine. Hence, we take heed to the Scripture’s admonition to “earnestly contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to the saints” (Jude 3). We should not, and cannot, do otherwise.' ____________________ THE PREACHER WHO DOESN’T TELL IT LIKE IT IS: THE TRUTH TWISTING AND TALL TALES OF JOYCE MEYER by Paul R. Belli and G. Richard Fisher This is an excerpt from the article. To read more go to: (http://www.pfo.org/preacher.htm) |
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2 | What was Jesus doing in the earth 3 days | Matthew | gracefull | 94750 | ||
'Answer: 'Moreover, in her 1991 booklet, [Joyce] Meyer asserts that salvation is impossible without believing Jesus suffered in hell as the believer’s substitute. Meyer writes, “There is no hope of anyone going to heaven unless they believe this truth I am presenting. You cannot go to heaven unless you believe with all your heart that Jesus took your place in hell.” If one believes Jesus died in their place, one either believes His death on the cross was all there was to the atonement and that after that He was in 'Paradise' waiting for the resurrection, OR that Jesus paid the full price of the sinner by becoming a sinner by taking on the sins of mankind. This seems to be the main starting point of division...There seems to be the idea that Jesus becoming a sinner on the cross in our place is original to WOF teachers. I would like to offer the following information to prove that Jesus becoming a sinner on the cross in our place is NOT an anti 'orthodox theology'. FYI This teaching did not originate with WOF. And I doubt it originated here...but it goes back at least to the 16th Century. Martin Luther 'Commentary on Galatians (Grand Rapids, MI Kregal Publications), edited by John Price Fallowes, M.A. Galatians 3:13-14 "And this, no doubt, all the prophets did forsee in spirit, that Christ should be accounted the greatest transgressor that could be, having all the sins imputed to Him. For He being made a sacrifice for sin, yea for the sins of the whole world, is not now the Son of God born of the virgin Mary, but a sinner who hathand carrieth the sin of Paul, who was a blasphemer and a persecutor; of Peter who denied Him; of David who was an adulterer and a murderer; and briefly, who hath and beareth all the sins of all men in His body;not that He is Himself guilty of any, but that He received them, being committed or done by us, and laid uponHis body, that He might make satisfaction for them with Hisown blood(Isa.53:5) Martin Luther goes on to say; "But some men will say, it is absurd and slanderous to call the Son of God a cursed sinner. I answer, if thou be wilt deny Him to be a sinner and accursed, deny also that He was crucified and dead. For it is no less absurd to say that the Son of God (as our faith professesth and believeth) was crucified and suffered the pains of sin and death, than to say that He is a sinner and accursed. But if it be not absurd to confess and believe that Christ was crucified between two thieves, then it is absurd to say also that He was accursed, and of all sinners the greatest." Martin Luther indicates here that he believes Jesus became 'a sinner' upon the cross...and that unless one acknowledges this, one should also deny that He was crucified and dead. My English grammer interprets this as 'If you deny He became a sinner you must also deny that He was crucified. The two are inseperable.' And he taught this in the 16th Century. Now this does not state that Jesus went to Hell, but it clearly states that Martin Luther believed Jesus literaly became accursed for us. He goes so far as to call Him the 'of all sinners the greatest.' As I stated in another post some time back, he also interpreted scripture to say God turned from God. He pronounced it a great mystery...but none the less acknowledged it. This was long before WOF teachers started teaching it, and my guess is Martin Luther would be considered an Orthodox theologian.. Jesus did not just die physically for our sins..but BECAME SIN for us. To believe this is scriptural, is only a very small step to believing Jesus went to Hell. God bless |
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3 | What was Jesus doing in the earth 3 days | Matthew | Hank | 94754 | ||
Gracefull: To believe that Christ bore man's sin on the cross is fully scriptural. But it is neither a small step nor does it point the way to believing that Christ suffered in hell for three days. It is no small step as you say; it is a giant leap, an heretical leap, that Scripture does not support nor did Martin Luther. WOF teaching on this subject is egregious error, it is blatantly false, it is wholly unorthodox, it is heresy of the first rank. Your quotations of Martin Luther, if they are, as they appear, designed to make Luther seem to be a forerunner of the Word Faith Movement, fall light years short of the mark, and your efforts to drag Luther into the WOF camp fall flat on their face. You are not going to be able to prove WOF teachings by Scripture, or by the Reformers, or by anyone else who adheres to Christian orthodoxy. The only people on the planet who buy into the WOF lies are those who have already been deceived by them or who are so ill versed in Scripture that they are vulnerable to them and are taken this false teaching. Jesus said on the cross, and He said it plainly, "It is finished." And Jesus never uttered a word that He didn't mean. --Hank | ||||||