Results 1 - 8 of 8
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Women in Ministry | 1 Tim 2:12 | yayatheresa | 145848 | ||
I have spent some time reading the notes, questions and responses on this site. This is my first note. I am a woman. I do not write this as someone with a personal and official ministry such as Joyce Meyer(?), Gloria Copeland, Paula White, etc. I am the wife of a deacon and considered a deacon as well in my church. I am also someone with a personal relationship with Christ and consider myself to be part of the "Great Commission" of Matthew 28:18-20. As of this writing that is the extent of my "ministry". I thank God for it and do not want to sound as if I minimize it. Only to assure the reader I do not have a personal agenda in what I write. I am seeking to know the truth as God declares it regardless of how it affects me personally as a woman. This writing of Paul in 1 Tim 2:11-12 as well as 1 Cor. 14:34-35 are the main texts given as to the silence of women in church. (Please anyone knowing of others let me know) I believe Paul explains the text in 1 Cor. by his response in V. 36. "What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?" He, as I understand, is responding to thier own teaching (V34 and 35) with his answer (V36). I will paraphrase it this way, "Are you serious? Are you God? and did you send out the word? or do you think you men are the only ones the word can come to?" The text in Timothy causes me to ask some questions. #1 Who is the man that the woman is not to usurp authority over? Is it any man at all? her husband? the male authority in her assembly? Or could it be Jesus Christ himself? #2 The use of the particular word usurp is important. One definition according to Webster is "to seize or exercise authority or possession wrongfully" Doesn't this sound like the woman here is trying to assume authority OVER the person (man or woman?) that God has placed in the position in question? Timothy was left in charge of the church in Ephesus where the main focus of the city had been on the worship of the goddess Diana. (Act 19:27-28) Could this spiritual wickedness have been a reason for this verse? I do not want to appear to say that this text is not for all times and all people. It is, as is all scripture. I have a problem with scripture being explained away with phrases such as "that was for their culture" or "that was for their time". I am convinced that God the Holy Spirit was not only in control of the content of the Holy Scriptures but also of preserving the exact content he wanted. No doubt there were letters and sermons that were for certain assemblies at certain times in history. These were not preserved by God to be set forth as timeless and changeless truths for all mankind. I know of no assembly of believes that adhere to a strict 'women in silence" doctrine. If we believe this is what Paul is teaching in 1Cor. 14:34-35 then women cannot be vocal at all in church. Not to sing, to testify, nothing. We cannot just pull out certain areas of speaking (preaching, teaching, etc.) and apply them here. If he meant keep silent. Then silent women must be. Does this line up with the multitude of other scriptures where women spoke about God and were used of God? For me it does not. Even in the Old Testament women could choose to: be a Nazarite (Num 6:2), be a prophetess (many instances Old and New Testament), Deborah was a Judge of Israel. Surely she had some authority over men in that position. Priscilla and her husband Aquila taught the man Apollos (Act 18:27). What is this? Can a woman teach one man and not two?. Is it the number of men present when she speaks or her geographical location at the time? Can she only expound and give what she has received from God only in her home? I am still learning and coming to an understanding of this and other, teachings. I am teachable and want with my whole heart to know the truth as God gives it. So I do not write this as an absolute. I would like some responses here to weigh out. For those who would wonder why I do not ask my own husband. We have studied this together and are of the same opinion and have the same questions. He has read this note and is interested as I am in the response we will receive. |
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2 | Women in Ministry | 1 Tim 2:12 | jirehway | 145884 | ||
Subject: Women in Ministry Note: yayathresa, I accidentally came upon your note re: women in ministry. I cannot write much at this time. It is 6:30 a.m. and I am preparing to minister at my churches this morning and later today to do the internment for a member who died this week. You see I am a Pastor or 3 churches, and I can safely say that anyone would have a extremely difficult time telling them that I am not called of God to preach. God's anointing rests heavily in my life (for which I am deeply grateful). I do not assume or presume authority over the men in my churches. I am called of God to serve and a servant knows who he/she belongs to. On business related items I work with a council comprised of both men and women. I refuse to argue with men or women re: my call because they did not call me, God did. I do not have to justify my call, the results of ministry does all of that. Today it is still very difficult for lady clergy in many places. I have been in ministry for over 30 years, to God be the glory! The years have not been easy years because of ingrained prejudice- from men and women. I resisted the call for a long time because of my upbringing. There were very few role models for me in the early 70's, yet God was faithful to teach and train me Himself and using others ministered (male) who recognized my call. I tell anyone who is considering going into pulpit ministry to avoid it if he/she can. The gifts and calling of God are without repentance and if God has or is calling you, you will not have peace and rest until you answer the call. Another note, women cannot afford to be good in ministry, she must strive for excellence as a testimony of God's call, grace and mercy. My question to you, respectfully I ask, what is the Holy Spirit speaking to your heart? If you are, as I feel you are, called to a spoken word ministry, you must think outside of the box or walls that mankind has made. God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and love and a sound mind. The gifts and calling of God are without repentance and no matter how long it takes, He will reveal Himself and your call to you. God has brought me a mighty long way and truly the journey gets sweeter every day. Finding and being in God's will is far greater than the approval of mankind or any material possessions. I offer the comments for your consideration not to debate, incite others who will read this, or flaunt my call in anyone's face. I write from deep love, much experience and a heart filled with thanksgiving that God saw fit to choose me. Blessings upon you and your husband as you seek clarification of your question. I have not meant to lift myself up before people, rather, to give you a bit of insight from one who has been through the fire and flood. His handmaiden, Jirehway |
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3 | Women in Ministry | 1 Tim 2:12 | Searcher56 | 145897 | ||
Jirehway, greetings, It doesn't matter if you think you are called to the pulpit. It is not prejudice, excpet that it is Biblical proof of women in minisrty. You said "I do not assume or presume authority over the men in my churches". Very strnage that the person in the pulpit is not in authority. Are you not a leader (Heb 13:17) ... Do you not care for the church of God (1 Tim 3:5)? It also doesn't matter in the results ... look at the cults, and Satan ... they do well. Does God support them? You may refuse to debate - but I have asked you questions that you must think about. Read my above post, Searcher |
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4 | Results DO matter | 1 Tim 2:12 | yayatheresa | 146251 | ||
I am very surprised at your statement "It also doesn't matter in the results..." Have you read where Jesus said "If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. But if I do, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me , and I in him." John 10:37-38? What if Jesus had not had "results" in His ministry. Also Mark 16:20 :And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen". And Mark 16:17 "And these signs (results) shall follow them that believe...." This is God's litmus test as to who is a believer? Each of us should measure our believing by our results. They do matter. These are only a few of the scriptures for your consideration. Are you implying that the confirmation God has promised doesn't matter. If that were true wouldn't you be saying that it is the one who is most able to articulate their faith one should believe is correct? I have heard Buddhists and Muslims and many other non-christian followers that are very convincing. If you believe that results really do not matter then you are leaving the unbelieving and unlearned to make their choice according to who they hear and who makes the best verbal argument for their faith. God is wiser than that. He knew the enemy is cunning and that is why He confirms His Word with "results". I understand that Satan can do some signs also. And of course God does not support them. The magicians withstood Moses and his wonders for a time. But all they could do was create the same curse (to a point). They could not bless the Egyptians by removing the curse Moses brought. Read it yourself. I hope you will see. |
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5 | Results DO matter | 1 Tim 2:12 | Searcher56 | 146255 | ||
I think about Acts 5:34-40 as well as cults, like the LDS and Watchtower. Look at their results, as well as others. They look great - but are of God? I also see churches that have breath (many in numbers) but lack depth (most still need the milk - not ready for the meat) (Heb 5:11-14). The results don't matter - they can be misleading, so is not absolute proof that God has His hand in it. |
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6 | Results DO matter | 1 Tim 2:12 | yayatheresa | 146260 | ||
Ok, so we don't agree. However you scripture reference of Acts 5:34-40 is one I would consider to show that results DO matter. Isn't Gamaliel saying that if this is of God it won't go away? There will be results. ???? | ||||||
7 | Results DO matter | 1 Tim 2:12 | DocTrinsograce | 146264 | ||
Hi, Vavatheresa... What Gamaliel is realizing is that God preserves His own work. Where we have to be careful is how we measure "results." Perhaps we need to qualify the word by "Godly results." Remember, prophets like Ezekiel and Jeremiah had no converts. In our way of looking at things they "had no results." Nevertheless, each walked in obedience to God, doing just as He had instructed. I hope I'm not muddying the waters here. However, I agree with you that results do matter. I also agree that results don't matter. :-) The key is, as I've said, what we mean by results. In Him, Doc |
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8 | Results DO matter | 1 Tim 2:12 | yayatheresa | 146266 | ||
Thank you, I understand what you are saying. I'll consider it. | ||||||