Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | why is baptism important | 2 Cor 5:17 | Reformer Joe | 22305 | ||
Tim: You wrote: "Spiritual rebirth ONLY takes place at the physical immersion (Baptism) in water." Explain the family of Cornelius. "For they were hearing them speaking with tongues and exalting God. Then Peter answered, 'Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?' And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days." --Acts 10:46-48 Clearly Cornelius received the Holy Spirit not AT baptism in water, but prior to it. In fact, it was by the clear demonstration of his regenerative state that Peter commanded them to be baptised. We see the same things at Pentecost. One cannot legitimately say that all those there who received the Holy Spirit had been water baptised at the same moment: "So then, those who had received his word were baptized; and that day there were added about three thousand souls." --Acts 2:41 Those who had received his word (past perfect) were baptised (after event #1). One does not receive the things of God without the Spirit of Christ (1 Corinthians 2:14). And we have the thief on the cross? But the other answered, and rebuking him said, "Do you not even fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation? And we indeed are suffering justly, for we are receiving what we deserve for our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong." And he was saying, "Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!" And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise." --Luke 23:40-43 No baptism, just belief. And the result? Salvation. Now I do not want to be characterized as saying that baptism is not important. One must wonder about the salvation of someone who has no desire to be baptized. However, the two are clearly not the same. --Joe! |
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2 | why is baptism important | 2 Cor 5:17 | Tim Sheasby | 22307 | ||
Sorry to disagree with you but the case of Cornelius is talking about something different. Cornelius was not saved until he was baptized. I know this because other scriptures clearly indicate this to be true. There is a difference between gifts of (from) the Holy Spirit and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Himself). Pentecost and Cornelius both show special events for special purposes -- to reveal the will of God. In both cases they had to be baptised to receive the Holy Spirit Himself. Romans 6 tells us that we are Baptised into Christ and Ephesians 1 shows that it is IN Christ that we have the Holy Spirit as a seal. Sin separates us from God and the only way we can receive remission of sins, according to Acts 2, is through repentance and baptism. Since it is sin that makes it impossible to enter heaven without baptism this also might answer your second objection -- the thief on the cross. Jesus had the power to forgive the sins of the thief while He was still on earth and so could promise the thief salvation. In addition though Jesus was dying the new testament had not yet been instated so rules that apply to salvation after the kingdom came with power at Pentecost do not apply before that date! We know that the blood of Christ extends back to cover the sins of those who died before the kingdom came but that does not mean that we can also be saved without baptism. Satan has done a wonderful snow job persuading us that we can be saved without baptism or by a baptism that is different to that taught in the Bible. If you believe you are saved and then get baptized just for obedience sake that is not the same as 'repent and be baptized, every one of you, for the remission of sins' Acts 2:38. Tim |
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3 | why is baptism important | 2 Cor 5:17 | Reformer Joe | 22322 | ||
Then please enlighten us as to what the case of Cornelius IS talking about. Scripture helps us understand Scripture. Did Cornelius receive the Holy Spirit or not? The apostle sure seemed to think so (he specifically uses this term, despite your insistence that Cornelius did not receive Him), and the inspired Luke sure didn't disagree with him. So tell us, Tim, what was the deal with Cornelius? Are you right or is the Bible right about Cornelius RECEIVING the Spirit? --Joe! |
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4 | why is baptism important | 2 Cor 5:17 | Tim Sheasby | 22324 | ||
Scripture clearly shows that new life/rebirth/remission of sins only takes place with baptism. Mark 16:16, Romans 6:5, Acts 2:38. The Holy Spirit gave Cornelius the ability to speak in tongues, not salvation. Nowhere in Acts 10 does it say Cornelius was saved by the coming of the Holy Spirit. I believe this to have happened as a sign to Peter and his friends -- Jews who would never have dealings with Gentiles under normal circumstances -- that Gentiles were now acceptable to God. It re-inforced the vision God had already given Peter and gave him the ability to argue for Cornelius and his family to be baptised. ALL examples of conversion in Acts are accompanied by baptism. This is the ONLY one where the one being converted received any special dispensation from the Holy Spirit. Tim |
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5 | why is baptism important | 2 Cor 5:17 | Reformer Joe | 22348 | ||
Tim: You wrote: "This is the ONLY one where the one being converted received any special dispensation from the Holy Spirit." Show me where and explain why Cornelius was a special case. Here we have clear example of someone receiving the Spirit (exact words) before baptism, and this is the BASIS for Peter ordering him to be baptised. It is very clear: 1. Cornelius hears the word of God. 2. Cornelius receives the Holy Spirit. 3. BECAUSE Cornelius has received the Holy Spirit, Peter orders that they be baptised. He even defends his action of baptising them on this basis in front of the Jerusalem elders. It is really quite clear, and nowhere does it say that Cornelius falls under some special dispensation. --Joe! |
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6 | why is baptism important | 2 Cor 5:17 | Tim Sheasby | 22438 | ||
Why was Cornelius a special case? The fact that Peter had to defend his action in baptizing Cornelius shows why. If Cornelius had not received the Holy Spirit then Peter and those Jewish brethren with him would have had great difficulty in accepting Cornelius in the first place and getting the rest of the churct to accept him in the second place. A simple sign from God. The Samaritans in Acts 8 were baptized and had to have the Apostles come down and lay their hands on them so that THEY could receive the Holy Spirit. -- Baptized first, Holy Spirit second. This does not mean that they did not have the seal of the Holy Spirit spoken of in Ephesians 1 or the gift of the Holy Spirit Peter spoke of in Acts 2. This is talking about miraculous gifts of the Spirit like was received by the Apostles in Acts 2:1 ff and Cornelius in Acts 10. The events of Acts 2 and Acts 10 are unique in Scripture. Except for those two occasions it is seen that miraculous gifts are given by the laying on of Apostles hands. Tim |
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7 | why is baptism important | 2 Cor 5:17 | retxar | 22442 | ||
Co 12:11 But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually AS HE WILLS. Spiritual gifts are given as the Holy Spirit wills. He can do it with hands or with no hands! Jesus Saves! retxar |
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