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NASB | John 10:28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | John 10:28 "And I give them eternal life, and they will never, ever [by any means] perish; and no one will ever snatch them out of My hand. |
Subject: once saved always saved |
Bible Note: Dear New Creature, You opened your reply to my post by stating: "All of Scripture not a few selected verses indicate the very real possibility of an individual departing from the faith he once held." But you then failed to offer me even a whole verse as a proof text! 1 Tim. 4:1 says "in the latter days some will depart from the faith" Any text taken out of context is a pretext. It is my experience that many (if not most) flawed interpretations arise from neglecting this elementary, but essential rule. The whole verse reads:" But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,...". I suggest we deal with the whole verse and also those following verses which expand upon it. The "latter days" or "later days" I think, means at some time sooner or later, as opposed to " the last days" which Paul used in 2 Tim 3:1. I don't know if this has any significance to our question, but I merely mention it in passing. By " ...some will fall away from the faith..." I take it you mean: some have lost their faith in Jesus Christ as their Lord and Saviour, thereby they have lost their salvation( If my assumption is incorrect, I apologize, I don't mean to put words in your mouth.) The reason that I cannot accept your interpretation is found in discovering what else is said about the opening clause in that follows it. Those who departed from the faith did so because, they paid attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons. What kind of men were spreading these doctrines and by what means were they spread? 1 Tim 4:2 by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron,". What were these decietful and demonic doctrines? Paul gives the answer in 1 Tim 4:3: " men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth." How does Paul answer the false doctrines of these liars? 1 Tim 4:4,5 "For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with gratitude; for it is sanctified by means of the word of God and prayer." Why does Paul instruct Timothy in what he has thusfar told him? 1 Tim 4:6 "In pointing out these things to the brethren, you will be a good servant of Christ Jesus, constantly nourished on the words of the faith and of the sound doctrine which you have been following." What should Timothy do? 1 Tim 4:7-9 "But have nothing to do with worldly fables fit only for old women. On the other hand, discipline yourself for the purpose of godliness; for bodily discipline is only of little profit, but godliness is profitable for all things, since it holds promise for the present life and also for the life to come. It is a trustworthy statement deserving full acceptance." Why should Timothy do these things? 1 Tim 4:10,11 "For it is for this we labor and strive, because we have fixed our hope on the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of believers. Prescribe and teach these things." You said: "If I'm correct, you need to first be "in the faith" before you can depart from it." I believe there is a distinction betwen being "in the faith" and "in Christ". It is possible, for instance, that a person be a member of the "faith" but not a possesor of faith. Jesus addressed this circumstance in Matt 7:22,23 "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.' I tust that you are satisfied that I have not used "selected verses" to force my interpretation onto the passage. John |