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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Where should I turn?????? | Bible general Archive 2 | javelin | 154487 | ||
I would note to other posters that daluvapassion15 asked for proof "other than the bible…" Using the bible to prove God's existence is circular reasoning. How can you prove the existence of God by using a book that you must first recognize as being from that God in the first place? daluvapassion15 : I suggest going through the following little bit of simple reasoning first to help you see that there has to be a Supreme Being. 1. Logical absolutes exist - to say they do not is to affirm it - "2 plus 2 equals 4" is always true in any universe and can never be false 2. Logic is conceptual - it is not a property of matter - it does not exist in nature : rocks, molecules, atoms etc. are not logical things - they just exist as matter 3. Since logic is conceptual it can only exist in mind or thought - therefore mind implies the existence of the meta-physical; i.e. that which is beyond the mere physical universe 4. Mind or thought must imply personality like reason implies a reasoner 5. Since logical absolutes exist and logic implies mind there therefore has to be an Absolute Mind from which and by which they exist are defined Simple huh? Furthermore : That Mind must have a personality or self-consciousness We can see then any absolute being necessarily refers the being we call GOD. The Absolute Mind, the Creator. It is quite reasonable therefore to expect that this Being who has created all things in the physical universe, having given every rational soul a mind like unto His own, that He would communicate with us. He would do this to insure that we do not conceive of Him as a mere created existence like some idol or creature. He would also do this to express His own nature to us. Since all humans have a thing called the moral sense - the notion that right and wrong really do exist and are not a mere invention of society -we may reasonably expect Him to have given us this since to know the difference between that right and that wrong. But the human race is full of suffering and evils of all kinds as is witnessed by all men’s experience in this world. The existence of evil, therefore, also gives this God a very good reason to reveal His existence to us in more than just a meta-physical way that our human frailty could easily miss. That revelation is in fact what we call the bible - a series of coherent writings from ages passed by people of different times that give witness to God and claim authority from God. Of course there are a ton of books claiming to be of divine origin these days. So how do distinguish bewtween the true and the false ? A good man named John Wesley once gave a very simple proof for the bible being the true word of God. He said, "The bible was either written by good men and angels, bad men and devils or God. Good men and angels could not have written it because they would not lie and say 'thus says the Lord'. Bad men and devils could not have written it because they would condemn themselves in it's pages. This only leaves God" Simplistic, I agree, but still a good brief proof. This forum's members could give you an excellent start in that books' authenticity and truth as versus the Koran and others. There are tons of posts here referring to biblical authenticity. Remember that there are around 23,000 copies or more of the original New Testament manuscripts MSS around today. All dated to the 1st or 2nd century AD. There are only about 7 copies Julius Caesars "Wars of Gaul" in existence and are all dated around 1000 years after their writing. We have an enormous amount of evidence for the resurrection of Jesus of Nazareth from the dead, his works and life. Christianity is the only true "religion" because it is the only one that can deal with a man's past, with a persons wrongs against God and others. It is the only one claiming to have a leader that is NOT DEAD but ALIVE ! I hope this helps. "Look unto Me and be saved all the ends of the earth". |
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2 | Where should I turn?????? | Bible general Archive 2 | humbledbyhisgrace | 154520 | ||
You say "Using the bible to prove God's existence is circular reasoning" I say using mankind's words and not using God's word to prove God's existence is at best a recipe for disaster. What could man possibly have to say about anything, especially God that would compare to His holy word much less have more meaning or truth to it or accomplish that which God himself pleases? Isa 55:11 "So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it. " My brother I do believe that God's word can and does reach even those that don't believe in the Bible if it be His will. Can you think of one thing man can say on his own that can accomplish what the holy word of our Father can do? Heb 4:12 "For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart." Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. I believe God's word is more then enough to reach even those that don't believe in the Bible if it is His will that they be saved. If man wants to say anything at all with any real meaning to it, I believe we should share the word of God and not think we can do any better on our own without His words of truth. If man is seeking God, then the best we can possibly do is repeat the holy words of our Father and share that with those seeking. After all, if one is seeking the truth, how can you possibly help them find it by excluding the truth? I would note to you my brother, daluvapassion15 may have ask for proof other then the Bible. But before daluvapassion15 ask that question it was already stated that he/she was confused. To remove God's word (the truth) from the discussion and use a lot of Apologetic arguments from the CARM web site or where ever they came from is in my opinion missing the mark big time. These type arguments if used at all to help someone confused should at a minimum be used with God's word first and foremost. We are not defending the faith here, we are acting out of love and trying to help the confused not the willful disbeliever. To remove the truth I believe would only tend to confuse the confused even more. |
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3 | Where should I turn?????? | Bible general Archive 2 | 2fedex | 154540 | ||
wow, do you honestly believe what you are saying? sir, with all due respect all truth comes from God the eternal one. I agree there are many who harden their hearts and will never receive Grace, but please never discount the efforts of an intelligent believer to help someone to see God even apart from the Bible. apologetics is also prescribed in our scripture in 1Peter 3:15. in addition Paul was perhaps the greatest apologist in history and if you think he didn't use apologetics go to Acts chapter 17 in verse 16 and following. your brother in Christ , fedexguy | ||||||
4 | Where should I turn?????? | Bible general Archive 2 | DocTrinsograce | 154541 | ||
Dear Fed, Not all that is true is in the Bible, although all things in the Bible are true. Humbledbyhisgrace is affirming the authority of Scripture. Sola Scriptura does not deny the ability of man to reason, on the contrary that is a given. As the old divines put it, "The Holy Scripture is the only sufficient, certain, and infallible rule of all saving knowledge, faith, and obedience, although the light of nature, and the works of creation and providence do so far manifest the goodness, wisdom, and power of God, as to leave men inexcusable; yet are they not sufficient to give that knowledge of God and his will which is necessary unto salvation." However, human reason is never fully sufficient to properly understanding the Scriptures. "The whole counsel of God concerning all things necessary for his own glory, man's salvation, faith and life, is either expressly set down or necessarily contained in the Holy Scripture: unto which nothing at any time is to be added, whether by new revelation of the Spirit, or traditions of men. Nevertheless, we acknowledge the inward illumination of the Spirit of God to be necessary for the saving understanding of such things as are revealed in the Word." In addition, we must remember that the human mind and heart do not always operate properly. They have been corrupted in the fall. Even the regenerate are subject to erroneous thinking, rationalizations, and inordinate affections. This forum emphasizes the authority of Scripture. The Word is, "the supreme judge, by which all controversies of religion are to be determined, and all decrees of councils, opinions of ancient writers, doctrines of men, and private spirits, are to be examined, and in whose sentence we are to rest." Consequently we seek to have the Scripture form the solid foundation from which we reason. We welcome your participation in the forum and look forward to your contributions. In Him, Doc |
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