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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Ephs 4:30; 1:13-14 | 2 Tim 1:12 | mark d seyler | 165801 | ||
Hi Ocelot, You cannot say that either King Saul or King David were born-again. Under the Old Covenant, based on man's action, you could indeed be "saved", then "unsaved", assuming you can actually use such terms within the context of the Old Covenant (See Ezekiel 18 for instance). But under the New Covenant, which is based on God's action, salvation is not a matter of works. You can no more gain salvation by good works than you can lose it by bad works. (See Ephesians 2:1-10) Salvation is connected to works. If your life does not demonstrate by your works that you are saved, you have no assurance that you are saved. (See James 2, Matt. 13:18-30) John 1:12-13 “But as many as received him, to them gave he power (exousia – right or authority) to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on (eis - into) his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.” John 10:27-29 “My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man (Lit. none or nothing) is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.” - not even us! 1 Peter 1:23 “Being born again, not of corruptible (decaying, mortal) seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.” Can you corrupt that which the Bible declares incorruptible? 1 John 2:24-25 “Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father. And this is the promise that he hath promised us, even eternal life.” See the next verse: 1John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. The new creation God makes in you when you are born again, what born-again is, you are given a living spirit (you were once spiritually dead) which is born of the Holy Spirit. And you no longer are a murderer, or adulterer, or liar. You are a child of God. The message of these scriptures is plain. We must be born of the Spirit. Sin brings death; God gives eternal life. God gives the right to be born of the Spirit. Spiritual birth is of incorruptible seed, by the word of God. This word lives and abides – stays - forever. If what you have heard (the word, the seed sown) abides in you, you shall also continue, in the promise of eternal life. You are one of Jesus’ sheep, you know Him, He knows you, and none can take you away. This is spiritual birth. To understand what qualifies you for this birth, hear what Jesus says about being His disciple. The words of these scriptures are plain and specific, that when you are born again, that birth if from God, of incorruptible seed, giving eternal live, which no one can take away. Eternal life is not eternal if it can be lost. If you are one to whom eternal life was given, and you lost it, and died, it was not eternal. There is no such thing as temporary eternal life. Some may make the objection that though no one can take you away, you can “walk away on your own”. The Bible says I won’t, and praise God for that! According to John 10:29, nothing, not even me, can pluck me from Jesus’ or my Father’s hand! John says “were born” – this is past tense! 1 John 5:13 says “These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life.” Again, eternal life is not eternal if it is temporary. This verse tells us we can know we have eternal life! Phi 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ: Which is the child of God whom God will break His promise to? 1Pe 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 1Pe 1:4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, 1Pe 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. Whose power is greater than God's which keeps us? No one's. Love in Christ, Mark |
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2 | Ephs 4:30; 1:13-14 | 2 Tim 1:12 | Ocelot | 165803 | ||
Here’s a little news for you. David was saved by the blood of Jesus, not by the blood of lambs, and certainly not by keeping the commandments. Just like every son of Adam and daughter of Eve since The Fall. If David, or anybody before Christ could have been saved by works, then heaven will be a lot emptier. You see, Christianity is not a new religion. Christ is not a new God. True Christianity is the continuation of the Jewish religion. Just as the Jewish religion was the continuation of the Patriarchs religion. And the Patriarchs religion was a continuation of Noah’s religion, and Noah’s religion was a continuation of Adam’s religion. There’s no “new” way to be saved. Christ has always been The Way. Secondly, God has a limit. He will not go against our Freedom of Choice. If I, who am saved, choose to be lost (may it never be), then He will not stop me. If we don’t have freedom of choice, then this whole sin thing has been just a big experiment by God. Like a child with an ant hill and a magnifying glass. But God is not that way. The, dear Mark, though you may be saved can choose to be lost. And God will honor your choice. |
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3 | Ephs 4:30; 1:13-14 | 2 Tim 1:12 | mark d seyler | 165805 | ||
Hi, Ocelot, I agree with you about how the OT saints are saved, by faith in Christ, looking ahead through the sacrificial system. But nonetheless, the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, being "born-again", made spiritually alive, was not something that happened under the Old Covenant. (by the way, Samuel told King Saul "you will be with me". Whether he meant "with me in death", or "with me in Abraham's Bosom" is open to interpretation. Saul may well meet us in heaven.) The whole thing about Abraham's Bosom makes an important point. The OT saints could not just come into God's presence when they died, not until Jesus actually died. When we die, we can go directly into God's presence because, well, we are actually in God's presence now, His Holy Spirit living in us, because He has made us holy. Pretty amazing! So the regenerate might choose to turn from God? The Bible doesn't teach that! God, after promising to hold my hand, and not let me go, but bring me safely home, would then, on my whim, just say, "Ok, go ahead!" and let go my hand, and let me run into the street in front of a bus? As I have presented Scripture that teaches the claims I have made, please make a Scriptural presentation, rather than simply making claims. Look at this logically. When I trust in Jesus, God forgives me of all sin. The penalty of all my sin is put on Jesus. I do not have to bear the consequence of my sin. Thankfully!!! Though He may allow some results of sin to remain in my life if it helps me to become more like Jesus, that's it. Certainly I do not suffer all the consequence of every sin, just so much as it serves His purpose. Let's say tomorrow I decide that I want to sin, and that I even go to the point of claiming that I no longer wish to serve God. This is a sin which Jesus died for, and will cleanse me of. This is a sin which God will monitor the consequence of, only allowing that which serves to make me more like Jesus. Misery, perhaps, but not hell. There is no "master me", an overall control system that decides whether I will be spiritually alive or dead. I was dead, God offered me life, and now I am alive. But it is God's doing that I am alive, not mine. (Eph 2) I was already dead because of sin, but God has made me alive. Sin can no longer kill me, because I have God's kind of life in me. (Romans 8) Do you think that when we sin, God listens to our dead flesh, that says "I don't want You anymore", or do you suppose He listens to our living spirit, which, in spite of our sin, cries out "Daddy, I want to live!" Love in Christ, Mark |
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