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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | why was the thief saved without baptism? | Luke 23:43 | Country Girl | 133227 | ||
You seemed to have left out a very important detail of this discussion and these words are from Christ himself: John 3:4 Nicodemus *said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? He cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born, can he?" John 3:5 Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. John 3:6 "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:7 "Do not be amazed that I said to you, 'You must be born again.' John 3:8 "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit." I've mentioned this kind of logic before but I'll repeat myself yet again. When the Bible teaches two or more different ways to answer a particular question such as this, it behooves one to be thorough and study all of what Scripture says about it. Now readily enough, everyone knows about Paul's statement: "one faith, one baptism,... But then the Bible also clearly states there are two different kinds of baptism cited within the Scriptures which were apparently applicable in their day when these Words were written. So we're left with a puzzle. Oviously Paul's words about "one baptism" were issued for guidance to ALL christians throughout all the age or this dispensation. The one single baptism that we can know for certain is indeed applicable to ALL christians is the one as Jesus referred to in being born again and thus the phrase "born again christian." Like I've mentioned before the age of miracles was a temporary one in this Christian dispensation. The baptism of the Holy Spirit was the primary source for these miraculous powers so since the Apostles, Cornelius and his family were the only ones blessed with these miraculous abilities from this primary source, it is perfectly logical to conclude that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is no longer applicable in this day and time. This also is in harmony with Paul's teaching in 1 Cor as there tends to be much strife and immature bickering between christians when they are blessed with these powers. I think it is correctly inferred from all this that God never really meant for us as His children to have these miraculous powers throughout this dispensation because in addition to the strife, it takes away from our development of our faith. If we had physical manifestations or demonstrations of miracles all the time like the Jews did in their world, they would become commonplace like they did then. The worst thing is that they lost their respect for God as shown at the very giving of the 10 Commandments to Moses. God wants us to grow up spiritually and learn to come to Him in simple faith based on what we know to be Bible based facts and the historical records that match them so perfectly. So, my friend, I must conclude the one baptism that's so important to Paul is the same watery grave of baptism important to today's christian. I hope this is all clear. Blessings to you. Country Girl PS: I know you know this being the learned Bible student you are but I need to mention for everyone else's benefit. The conclusion cited above is shared now and has been promulgated by christians by the tens of millions plus throughout all 2000 years of the church's existence. PSS: As to why our Lord didn't make this more clear i.e. as in a Standard Operating Procedure or a manual, etc. I'd have to refer you to God Himself upon Judgment Day. |
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2 | why was the thief saved without baptism? | Luke 23:43 | Morant61 | 133243 | ||
Greetings Country Girl! We will just have to disagree about miracles and spiritual gifts my friend. I am simply not prepared to accept 'speculation' as gospel truth. :-) There simply isn't any Scripture that says that spiritual gifts HAVE been done away with. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | why was the thief saved without baptism? | Luke 23:43 | Country Girl | 133270 | ||
As I've said in several posts in the past, I'm firmly convinced that God knows His Word does NOT provide every answer to every question we could possibly think up. We just know and are assured that He does answer ALL the questions we NEED to have answered so as to go Home to Heaven. We've all discovered some very tough topics that just defy truly clear answers so I'll settle for your position and resolve to keep studying and praying on the matter. I'm also thankful to Him that it's not hinged on salvation one way or the other. I would encourage all who may be reading to study ALL of God's Word and draw your own conclusions. That's one thing that the Bible is very clear about from Peter: 1 Pet 3:14 But even if you should suffer for the sake of righteousness, you are blessed. AND DO NOT FEAR THEIR INTIMIDATION, AND DO NOT BE TROUBLED, 1 Pet 3:15 but sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence; 1 Pet 3:16 and keep a good conscience so that in the thing in which you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ will be put to shame. I'm sure you already know that part of the Greek meaning behind the word "defense" means using our logical minds. So this is most certainly an endorsement from our Lord that we ARE commanded to use our intellect to deduce certain conclusions from His Word. We just have to be thorough and draw the right conclusion after studying ALL of what He says on each respective subject. Blessings to you, my dear friend. Country Girl |
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