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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Why little sign of power in our churches | Mark 16:17 | Suede67 | 93299 | ||
Hi Steve, no problem jumping in late either, I do it way too often myself! I'm glad 1 Corinthians 13:8 caught your eye. That one verse, and the few surrounding it, has troubled many a theologian. The sad thing is, it doesn't have too! Let me put it to you like this, there are no such things as Bible difficulties!! There is only Theology Difficulties. The Bible doesn't have a problem, our theology does. We want the Bible to fit our theology, instead of having our theology fit the Bible. ...Are you suggesting that "then" has already come? Has the event that Paul referred to - "when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears" - has already happened? Has perfection already come a second time? ... Yes, but know that it is not I that suggests, it's the Bible that tells. Let me drop this on you cause you seem ready to hear it, Christ told his disciples that he would return in 40 years. And he said his return would be a like a flash of lightning. People want to physically see Christ coming down from the sky with organ music playing and a heavenly choir. Very theatric, but not Biblically correct. If Christ did NOT return in 40 years, He was a liar and is therefore NOT the Messiah. Now, personally, I'm not going to say that. ...That is when gifts such as prophecy and tongues will disappear. 1 Corinthians 13 makes perfect sense apart from any discussion of whether or not God has suspended spiritual gifts... Yes, and this too makes sense with the rest of the Bible. Ok, there's two ages listed in the Bible, as far as the NT goes. Check it out for yourself. The apostles state that there is this Age, which was the Age relevant to THEIR lifetime, and then the Age to come, which is relevant to OUR lifetime and has be relevant since 70 AD. The Ages was the passing of the OT covenant into the NT Covenant. We are now in the eternal Covenant. Think about it like this, why do we need prophesy anymore? What on earth is left to tell? ...I'd be interested to know what you think the Holy Spirit is supposed to do "in" us. It seems to me that anything he is likely to do "in" me will probably manifest itself in some outward way - as a gift of the spirit.... Yes, the Holy Spirit, i.e. God IS in you. Your body is His temple and He dwells in you. And Paul tells us that Love is now the gift that remains. It is the only apt gift now when you think about it. You see, gifts like healing and prophesy were there to edify the early church, which desperately needed these things. Remember, Rome and Paganism was against it, but also the non Believing Jews were as well, which is equaling depressing. The early church needed something to show that it was the ONE true faith. Gifts provided that. Remember, all the prophets, and Jesus himself, could perform miracles. Why? To show that they were from God in a time of trouble. Now God IS here. Satan IS under our feet. Satan has been defeated, just like the Bible says. Gifts aren't needed anymore, we have full authority here. Now, we need to go spread the Gospel and tell the people the good news!! We win, because Christ won, just like the Bible tells us. Take care, SUEDE |
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2 | Why little sign of power in our churches | Mark 16:17 | Morant61 | 93327 | ||
Greetings Suede! You said: "Let me drop this on you cause you seem ready to hear it, Christ told his disciples that he would return in 40 years" Where exactly does Scripture say that Christ would return in 40 years? You also wrote: "People want to physically see Christ coming down from the sky with organ music playing and a heavenly choir. Very theatric, but not Biblically correct." I can't speak to the organ music and the choir, but what did the angels say in Acts 1 after Christ ascended to Heaven? Acts 1:11 - "'Men of Galilee,' they said, 'why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven." Now, how did Jesus go into Heaven? Acts 1:9 says, "After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight." Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | Why little sign of power in our churches | Mark 16:17 | Suede67 | 93329 | ||
Hey Tim, ...Where exactly does Scripture say that Christ would return in 40 years?... Olivet Discourse. We know from the OT, that a generation to the Jews is 40 years, Jesus said he would be back in one generation. ...I can't speak to the organ music and the choir, but what did the angels say in Acts 1 after Christ ascended to Heaven? Acts 1:11 - "'Men of Galilee,' they said, 'why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven." Now, how did Jesus go into Heaven? Acts 1:9 says, "After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight."... Actually, these verse DO mesh with what Jesus said, and of course with Preterist eschatology. We know that Jesus "went" into heaven behind a cloud. That's key. For how is He coming? Let the Bible tell us. Mattew 26:24 Jesus said to him, "You have said it yourself; nevertheless I tell you, hereafter you will see THE SON OF MAN SITTING AT THE RIGHT HAND OF POWER, and COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF HEAVEN." Mark 13:26 "Then they will see THE SON OF MAN COMING IN CLOUDS with great power and glory." What does this mean? Coming in clouds invokes OT prophets that poetically spoke of God coming in clouds of Judgement. We can further see this here, Revelation 1:7 "BEHOLD, HE IS COMING WITH THE CLOUDS, and every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the tribes of the earth will mourn over Him. So it is to be. Amen." Another thing we can ask is, how fast will this coming be? A slow descent? No. Matthew 24:27 "For just as the lightning comes from the east and flashes even to the west, so will the coming of the Son of Man be." cf Luke 17:24 His coming was that quick. Take care, SUEDE |
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4 | Why little sign of power in our churches | Mark 16:17 | Morant61 | 93330 | ||
Greetings Suede! Thanks for the response my friend! One of my primary concerns is accuracy in our statements about what Scripture says. So, I highlighted your '40' years remark. There are two problems with your statement. First of all, the term '40 years' is never used. While 'a generation' may refer to 40 years, Scripture never says '40 years'. Secondly, Mt. 24:34 refers to 'this generation', but which generation is He refering to? It could very well be the generation alive when the things mentioned occur. Whether we agree on our approach to eschatology or not, it simply isn't true that Christ said He would return within 40 years. :-) Finally, concerning Acts 1:9-11, verse 9 says that He went up 'before their eyes, and then the cloud hid Him. So, verse 11 must also be refering to a visible return since it says that He would return in the same way. So, I don't agree that the preterist position is in harmony with Acts 1:9-11. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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5 | Why little sign of power in our churches | Mark 16:17 | Suede67 | 93340 | ||
Hi Tim, ...One of my primary concerns is accuracy in our statements about what Scripture says. So, I highlighted your '40' years remark. There are two problems with your statement. First of all, the term '40 years' is never used... In a literal sense, no, it's not. However, a Jew telling other Jews in the first century that he would return in a generation would have been understood as a 40 year time frame. We tend to modernize the Bible and come up with odd interpretations when we do. The BIG explaination used by futurists is that Generation means a race of people. This is the kind of silliness I mean. ...Secondly, Mt. 24:34 refers to 'this generation', but which generation is He refering to?... Take it into context. Jesus meant that generation that was alive when he was speaking. If I were to say "this is the greatest year ever", do I mean 2005? Or 1995? No, time context when the statement made is 2003. Same thing. Jesus said "This generation", as in the 1 st century. ...It could very well be the generation alive when the things mentioned occur.... And it did! All those things mentioned DID occur in the first century. ...Whether we agree on our approach to eschatology or not, it simply isn't true that Christ said He would return within 40 years... Yes it is true, our 21st minds though fail to realize this at times. Jesus was very much a 1st century Jew, and was using language of that time. Hundreds of years from now, what will be think when we say someone "kicked the bucket", or "bought the farm". ...Finally, concerning Acts 1:9-11, verse 9 says that He went up 'before their eyes, and then the cloud hid Him. So, verse 11 must also be refering to a visible return since it says that He would return in the same way. So, I don't agree that the preterist position is in harmony with Acts 1:9-11.... But then the "burden of proof" is on you. Why does every other verse state coming in clouds? And why does Jesus himself say he will return as fast as lightning? Hardly a slow visible descent the way the apostles saw him him ascend for a moment. Is this a Bile difficulty? No. Acts matches up only if we acknowldge the clouds in the other verses, like Rev 1:7. The angels were telling the apostles about the clouds. It's not so much the verses we do list, it's what we DON'T list that matters. Take care, SUEDE |
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