Results 1 - 5 of 5
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | More on Mt. 6:14 -15? | Matt 6:14 | Morant61 | 16536 | ||
Greetings Bill! I need to correct my last paragraph! :-) It should read: "Neither view is without problems. You seem to take it to refer only those before the resurrection of Christ. If this is the case, does Mt. 6:14-15 mean that everyone who forgave others before the death of Christ was forgiven by God?" Sorry about that! Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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2 | Forgiveness - Part 2 of 3 | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16540 | ||
Forgiveness - Part 2 or 3 That being said, we must understand that when Christ was physically here on earth, the Old Covenant was still in full effect. Gal 4:4 states that Christ was born under law (Old Covenant law) and most of His teaching surrounded it. He Himself said that He did not come to abolish it, with His life, but to fulfill it. And having fulfilled the Old Covenant perfectly, He has brought in a New Covenant, a covenant of grace. Now, let’s take a look at the passage in question, Matthew 6:14: “For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.” I feel that the best explanation of this passage can be found in Matt 5:23, 24: "Therefore if you are presenting your offering at the altar, and there remember that your brother has something against you, leave your offering there before the altar and go; first be reconciled to your brother, and then come and present your offering.” Here we see that Jesus says, ‘If you bring your offering to the altar (obviously a sin offering), and there remember that there’s a problem between you and your brother (another Jew), leave your offering, go make things right with your brother, then come back and offer your sacrifice.’ The Jews as a people, at this point in time, only knew of only one way to get forgiveness of sins – animal sacrifice. This system was still operational while Christ walked the earth. They understood that. It was the only system that they had every known for having their sins forgiven. And Christ never refuted it during His earthly life. Rather, He upheld the law. But He was also trying to get His listeners to look beyond the ceremony and tradition to see their hearts as God saw them. So He admonished them (my loose paraphrase), ‘If you’re coming to get forgiven by God, don’t just go through the motions. The law is summed up in loving God and loving your neighbor as yourself. So, yes, forgiveness is provided for you. But go beyond the requirements of the law and see that God cares about relationships. Try to heal those and then seek God’s provision of forgiveness and it will mean something to you.’ Christ condemned religious tradition for the sake of tradition alone. He wanted people to get past the rules to the relationships. So He says, ‘Forgive your brother, THEN come and offer your sacrifice. He NEVER said, ‘Don’t offer your sacrifice at the temple.’ Why not? Because that system, that pointed to His once-for-all sacrifice, had not YET been done away with. So why doesn’t He mention sacrifice in Matthew 6:14? I feel that it is because the Jews already knew what, under law, was required to provide forgiveness. If you had told a Jew at that time, “You sinned, you need forgiveness,” he would have tried to find an appropriate sacrifice and trotted off to the temple. But Christ was trying to show them that God looks on the heart. End of part 2 - see part 3 |
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3 | Forgiveness - Part 2 of 3 | Matt 6:14 | Morant61 | 16551 | ||
Greetings Bill! I would only have two problems with this post! 1) Explaining Mt. 6:14-15 by refering to a sacrifice mentioned in Mt. 5:23-24 is quite a stretch. Mt. 5:23-24 is the only sacrifice mentioned in the entire Sermon on the Mount. 2) Most see the Sermon on the Mount as more than just an explanation of the Old Testament Laws. Most see the Sermon on the Mount as a presentation of the Kingdom of God. Yes, Jesus deals with the inadequate view of the Pharisees. But, He goes beyond their view to the better way. This would be the only point where we would disagree. I don't believe that the things written in the Sermon on the Mount can be relegated only to the Old Covenant. However, I fully agree with your view of forgiveness. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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4 | Forgiveness - Part 2 of 3 | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16567 | ||
Dear Tim, please don't think that I am regulating everything that Christ said (or even the entire Sermon on the Mount) to only applying to the Old Covenant. If you have perceived that that is what I'm saying, then either I missed something in my explanation or you have misunderstood me. Christ did often teach and uphold the law. But our Lord often exercised grace and mercy one on one. Consider the woman caught in adultery. The law said that for her sin, she should die. Christ NEVER rescinded that. Instead, He took it to a heart issue and caught the self-righteous in their own trap. But, to the adulteress He said, "Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more." People will sometimes read my comments and say, 'Bill is a Pauline.' Or, 'Bill doesn't believe that anything Jesus said is applicable to the Christian.' That allegation is simply not true. And I am not trying to set myself up as the judge of what applies and what does not. But I do feel that certain issues, forgiveness being one of those issues, were dealt with COMPLETELY at the cross. We, as Christians, MUST understand what happened at the cross and the resurrection if we are to properly understand Christ's teachings. I.e., if the OT means of providing forgiveness was sufficient, then why did Christ die to provide another way? Why didn't He just leave the animal sacrifice system alone? Why? Because that system pointed to HIM and what HE would do. Hebrews says time after time how superior the New Covenant, the new High Priest, the new priesthood, the new sacrifice is to the old. As I've tried to show in these posts, ultimate forgiveness was provided at the cross. Almost everything that Christ said about the cross and His death related to sins and forgiveness. So, to me, the cross is the final word on the forgiveness of sins for mankind. Is the Sermon on the Mount a presentation of the Kingdom of God? Surely. Christ was dealing with the attitudes of the heart and their subsequent actions. Much of what He says is of the style, 'the law says...but I tell you...' And He told the people that unless their righteousness exceeded that of the Pharisees (letter-of-the-law righteousness) they would not enter the kingdom of heaven. He covers many topics here: personal relationships, giving to the poor, fasting, true wealth, anxiety, judging others, prayer, etc. Does the cross deal DIRECTLY with these issues? No, not directly. But our lives AFTER the cross does. And if your walk with the Lord is anything like mine, believe me, the Holy Spirit deals with me on these issues. But the forgiveness issue is dealt with DIRECTLY at the cross. That is while I feel that a subsequent revelation (complete forgiveness through Christ's sacrifice) supercedes what He taught here. Could I be wrong? Yes. I could be. And like my 1 John 1:9 post, challenge me. Where, after the cross, does God say 'forgive or you will not be forgiven.' (If you do, let's start another thread, OK?) I am not saying that I will resort to this tactic for every argument. But, dear Tim, you know, if you're a pastor, many, many Christians are confused about the forgiveness of sins. Why do you think this topic is such a hot one on the forum? There must be an answer. We are all seeking it. Thanks for your kind critique. Keep me challenged. Blessings to you, brother Tim. In Christ, Bill Mc |
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5 | Forgiveness - Part 2 of 3 | Matt 6:14 | Morant61 | 16597 | ||
Greetings Bill! Thanks for the clarification! I did sort of get the impression that you felt everything Jesus said before His death was no longer valid. I've got to get to bed now, so I chat with you later. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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