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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Cajam Please explain | Bible general Archive 2 | Makarios | 97180 | ||
Greetings Cajam, God qualifies as having personhood in that He exists, is self aware, has identity, uses terms such as "Me", "I AM", "My", and possesses a will. The question now becomes whether or not there are more than one "persons" in the Godhead. "Let this cup pass from Me." "And he was withdrawn from them about a stone’s cast, and kneeled down, and prayed, [42] Saying, 'Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done'" (Luke 22:42). "And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, 'O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt'" (Matt. 26:39). In both Luke 22:42 and Matt. 26:39 (which are parallel passages), the context is Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane, right before His betrayal. He was praying to the Father about the ordeal He was about to undergo. Several points are worth bringing out here. First, in this passage, Jesus addresses the Father. He says, "Oh my Father..." Note that Jesus says "my" and "Father." These two words designate a "me and you" relationship. Second, "If it be possible" is Jesus expressing a desire, a hope. What is that hope or desire? It is that "this cup pass from me." The cup Jesus is speaking of is the immanent ordeal of betrayal, scourging, and crucifixion. Jesus did not want to go through this. He was expressing His desire. It was His will not to undergo the severe ordeal ahead of Him. If this was not so, He would not have expressed the desire to have the cup pass from Him. Third, in Matt. 26:39, Jesus says, "Nevertheless., not my will, but thine, be done." In Luke 22:42 he says, "Nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt." With this, Jesus is expressing His will and contrasting it to the will of the Father. Yet, He is stating that even though He does not want to undergo what lay ahead, "Nevertheless," He would submit to the will of the Father. This shows that the person of Jesus had a separate and different will than the Father. Since we have two separate simultaneous wills, we have two separate and simultaneous persons and Oneness Pentecostal theology is incorrect. Questions to ask a Oneness person: Is Jesus His own Father? If Jesus' will and the Father's will were identical (in an attempt to demonstrate that there is only one will), then why did Jesus express the desire to escape the cup but resigns Himself not to His own will, but the will of the Father? Was Jesus praying to Himself at this point? Was Jesus saying, "Not My will, but My will be done?" if there is only one person and one will involved? [Courtesy of http://www.carm.org/oneness/3persons.htm] - Makarios |
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2 | Cajam Please explain | Bible general Archive 2 | cajam | 97227 | ||
You seem to forget that Jesus was not only the Son of God but he was also the Son of Man.God did not break any of his natural Laws to accommandate his Son. He got hungry, tired and ,yes, Pray just as any human.He even had to be baptized,when he had no sin, to fulfill all Righousness.You do not understand what Jesus had to face.It was not the beating and Death.But he had to bare the sins of the world.The human side had a will but he never gave in to it to the point that it when outside the well of God. | ||||||
3 | Cajam Please explain | Bible general Archive 2 | Makarios | 97229 | ||
Sorry Cajam, But you've already admitted that Jesus prayed to the Father. :-) Therefore, you have admitted that the Father and the Son are two separate Persons of the Trinity. I've got you. :-) Makarios |
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4 | Cajam Please explain | Bible general Archive 2 | DarcyA | 97236 | ||
Makarious there is NO ONE who actually believe in oneness. :) If he stays with this thread he will admit to thr trinity over and over again. He is triniturian. Just doesn't know it yet. | ||||||
5 | Cajam Please explain | Bible general Archive 2 | Makarios | 97240 | ||
Darcy: I know. *wink* | ||||||