Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Does anyone have a good way to explain t | Bible general Archive 1 | TheCurtMan | 87597 | ||
Hey Truthfinder, Thanks for answering question 3. in your notes to Tim. I'm under the impression that scripture also stipulates that there is only one God, Isa. 44:6 and 45:5. Now if Jesus isn't Jehovah, and if Jesus is 'a god', then aren't you suggesting polythesim?? the belief in more than one God |
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2 | Does anyone have a good way to explain t | Bible general Archive 1 | Truthfinder | 87644 | ||
Hi Curtman Yes, you are exactly correct as far as I am concerned. Isa. 44:6 and 45:5 tells us there is only one God (mighty one) to us that should be viewed as the Supreme God, Almighty God, The Father. To view any other God in his place is wrong. It is interesting that you ask this question, because the making of more that one god as the sole GOD is exactly polytheistic. Remember what the words “elohim and “theos” mean. Anything venerated, a mighty one. Remember too that paying honor to such ones in a relative sense may be both proper and righteous. However polytheism is most certainly idolatry. Egypt’s religion was polytheistic, characterized by over 500 gods, and possibly twice that many. “Throughout Egypt generally the company of gods of a town or city were three in number,” says Egyptologist E. A. Wallis Budge. In time, a principal triad developed, a holy family composed of Osiris, the father; Isis, the mother; and Horus, the child. Polytheism resulted in several gods’ claiming to be ‘the sole god.’ But priests and theologians evidently saw no problem in believing in one god and at the same time viewing him as existing in a multitude of forms. Author B. Mertz comments that this “is only another example of that pleasant inconsistency which is so characteristic of Egyptian religion.” When the Son of God, Jesus is viewed as the sole God as the Father only should be viewed, is exactly polytheistic. Recognizing Jesus as a Mighty One (Elohim) is not polytheistic as long as he is not viewed as the Almighty One. Worshipping Jesus as the Son of God is relative and proper but worshipping him as the sole God in stead of as the Son of God is not. Jesus is the one that said, “It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.” Mat. 4:10 quoting Deut. 10:20 Actually the phrase “other gods” appears 84 times in the Bible and 5 times as “other god”. To error is to say all these are false gods (mighty ones. The Bible plainly says they are gods. Satan is a god, plain and simple. 2 Cor. 4:4. What kind of god is he? He is a "false" god. But just because he should not be worshipped as the Almighty God does not make him “no god”. To illustrate: John 8:12 tells us that Jesus is the “light” of the world. But what happens when we read Mat. 5:14? Are Jesus’ disciples “false lights” “not lights” of the world? Of course not. They were still “lights” but not in the same sense that Jesus was and still is the “light” of the world. 1 Tim 1:17 identifies Jesus’ Father as the “one true God”. Additionally to whom did Jesus say he was ascending to when he said, “to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.”—Joh 20:11-18. Polytheism is idolatry, thus Jesus is the Son of God and Jesus’ Father is Almighty God. To say otherwise is an invention of man and contradicts scripture and takes away the due honor to our heavenly Father Jehovah. Truthfinder |
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3 | Does anyone have a good way to explain t | Bible general Archive 1 | Morant61 | 87650 | ||
Greetings Truthfinder! In other words my friend, even though Is. 44:6 and 45:5 say that there are no other 'elohim', you say that there are in fact other 'elohim'. In fact, you tried to pull a bait and switch on us. Is. 44:6 and 45:5 do not use the term 'mighty God', they both use 'elohim' - Strong's number 430. Yet, in your response, you say: "Yes, you are exactly correct as far as I am concerned. Isa. 44:6 and 45:5 tells us there is only one God (mighty one) to us that should be viewed as the Supreme God, Almighty God, The Father." But, these two verses do not use the term 'mighty one', they both use 'elohim'. Neither do these two verses say that 'for us' there is only one 'elohim' who should be 'viewed' as the supreme God. They both say that there 'are no other elohim' - period! You then said: "Recognizing Jesus as a Mighty One (Elohim) is not polytheistic as long as he is not viewed as the Almighty One." But, now you have totally ignored the clear statements of Scripture which say that there are no other 'elohim'. The following verses all say that there are no other 'elohim': a) Is. 44:6 - "Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God." b) Is. 45:5 - "I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:" c) Is. 45:21 - "1Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me." d) Is. 46:9 - "Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me," These are very simple and direct declarations. They do not say that God is the greatest of the 'elohim'. They say that He is the only 'elohim'. Therefore, when Scripture also says that Jesus is God, He must be the only 'elohim' as well. So, who is contradicting Scripture my friend? Further, your whole discussion about Egypt is a strawman. They (and you) believed in many gods, we only believe in One God! We don't teach, nor do we believe that Jesus is one God and the Father is another. Scripture is quite clear that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are God, not gods. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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4 | Does anyone have a good way to explain t | Bible general Archive 1 | Truthfinder | 87676 | ||
Hi Tim, You keep ignoring that if one or two verses say there is only one God and then the other verses I have shown you, identify others such as angels and certain men as gods, then the only way to understand Is. 44:6 and 45:5 is the way I explained them. Otherwise you are ignoring those verses that identify these others as "elohim" gods or mighty ones. One example: At Psalm 8:5, the angels are also referred to as ´elo·him´, as is confirmed by Paul’s quotation of the passage at Hebrews 2:6-8. They are called beneh´ ha ´Elo·him´, “sons of God” (KJ); “sons of the true God” (NW), at Genesis 6:2, 4; Job 1:6; 2:1. Lexicon in Veteris Testamenti Libros, by Koehler and Baumgartner (1958), page 134, says: “(individual) divine beings, gods.” And page 51 says: “the (single) gods,” and it cites Genesis 6:2; Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7. Hence, at Psalm 8:5 ´elo him´ indeed is used not as false gods but "elo him" and is rendered “angels” in the(LXX)and “godlike ones” in the NWT. Truthfinder |
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5 | Does anyone have a good way to explain t | Bible general Archive 1 | Morant61 | 87852 | ||
Greetings Truthfinder! Those one or two verses which say that there is only one God are God Himself speaking. So, are you claiming that God was in error or lying? Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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6 | Does anyone have a good way to explain t | Bible general Archive 1 | Truthfinder | 87889 | ||
Hi Tim, I am certainly not saying God is lying Titus 1:2. Yet 2 Tim 3:16 says "all" scripture is inspired of God", so "his" use of elohim, el, elim, and theos must be understood as "gods" too. That is why the most common Biblical word in the original was whvh, to identify the one true God that is to be given exclusive devotion. Therefore Jesus is "worshipped" in a relative sense. He should be worshipped, be given honor as God's only-begotten son, not as the Almighty who alone deserves exclusive devotion. Exclusive devotion is demanded by Jehovah in the second of the “Ten Words” or Ten Commandments written by the finger of God: “I am Jehovah your God . . . You must never have any other gods against my face [or, “any other gods in defiance of me”]. . . . because I Jehovah your God am a God exacting exclusive devotion.” (De 5:6-9) 17 Because the Law was given through Moses, the undeserved kindness and the truth came to be through Jesus Christ. John 1:18 No man has seen God at any time; the only-begotten god who is in the bosom [position] with the Father is the one that has explained him. Mat. 4:10 10 Then Jesus said to him: “Go away, Satan! For it is written, ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.’” As you say Tim, then did Jesus lie? Truthfinder |
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7 | Does anyone have a good way to explain t | Bible general Archive 1 | Morant61 | 87933 | ||
Greetings Truthfinder! The only problem with your response my friend is that these verses in Isaiah do not use the term 'Almighty', they use the term 'elohim'. They specifically say that there is no other 'elohim' besides Me! So, was God telling the truth or not? Concerning your question about Jesus, He was not lying because He is Jehovah! :-) So, there is no conflict with worshipping Jesus, since He is Jehovah. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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