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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Is sinless perfection possible on earth? | 1 John 1:8 | biblicalman | 228731 | ||
Perhaps in view of what has been said on this forum we should consider certain facts about the use of Greek in the New Testament The so-called 'historic present' is to my knowledge only used in the Gospels. I have discovered no instance where it is used by Paul or in theological narratives. Examples of its rare use in the Gospels are where it is used to make the historical descriptive narrative vivid (we do the same in English). For example: Matthew 3.1 'In those days comes John --.' John 1.29 'On the next day He sees John and says --.' Mark 11.27; 12.9 'They come to Him --.' (Matthew has 'they came'. In the New Testament its usage is therefore strictly limited. It cannot be taken as a general rule that a present can be used as a past tense. It is limited to historical descriptive narrative. With regard to the aorist it is used as a present in the following examples: 'My beloved Son in Whom I am well pleased (aorist)' 'If you love me keep (aorist) my commandments.' 'Praise (aorist) the Lord all the nations and let all the peoples sing praises (aorist) to Him' (Romans 15.11). 'Awake (aorist) to righteousness and sin not' (1 Cor 15.34). 'Draw out (aorist) the water and bear (present) to the governor of the feast' (John 2.8) 'Take (aorist) these things hence -- (john 2.16) These are clear examples and make plain that the aorist can be used of the present, and can be used of continual action. Best wishes to all. I hope this is helpful |
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2 | Is sinless perfection possible on earth? | 1 John 1:8 | Morant61 | 228735 | ||
Greetings Biblicalman! I apologize, I just realized that I did not complete my thought about aorist imperatives. :-) An aorist imperative does not indicate present continual action. It indicates a command, which has not yet been obeyed, without saying anything about the duration of the action. The imperative, like the optative, subjection, and future moods, is a mood of possiblity. I am assuming that this discussion on aorists relates to my understanding of Eph. 4:22-24. The aorists in Eph. 4:22-24 are infinitives, and seem to be designed to make a point. We are to "put off" the old man v. 22 (an event viewed as a whole or even completed action), and we are to "put on" the new man v. 24. If Paul had meant a continual action, then he could have simply used the present infinitive, which distinctly carries that meaning. The contrast though is stark. The 'be made new' in v. 23 is a present, passive infinitive. It clearly indicates an ongoing process done to us (or for us) by the Spirit. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | Is sinless perfection possible on earth? | 1 John 1:8 | biblicalman | 228738 | ||
Hi Tim I will discuss Greek tenses in another post. I will simply say that the aorist is a bit like the tongue. The aorist can no man tame. It has a life of its own. I get sick of reading in commentaries by high level Greek scholars the number of inferences that can be made from the aorist, all conflicting with each other. Now to look at your question: You said The aorists in Eph. 4:22-24 are infinitives, and seem to be designed to make a point. We are to "put off" the old man v. 22 (an event viewed as a whole or even completed action), and we are to "put on" the new man v. 24. My reply: Well I do not see this as continual action, but I do see it as an action that has to be repeated. Clealy when we are faced ith Paul's command we have to make a decision whether we will 'put off the old man', in other words will begin to reckon on ourselves as dead to sin and alive to God. In that sense it is completed action. We make the decision and act on it. But it certainly does not mean that we are done with sin. What is the old man? It is I as I am when I am not in obedience to Christ. It is my old life. Puttng on the new man means that I come in full submission to Christ. I reckon on myself as alive to God through Jesus Christ my Lord. I allow the risen Christ to take control of my life. Putting on the new man is allowing the renewed mind to take conrol. But it will only succeed if I am fully responsive to the Holy Spirit. But as you say we are 'being made new' as a continuing process. As 2 Corinthians 3.18 puts it, by beholding the glory of Christ we are being changed from glory into glory by the Spirit of the Lord. Thus there is a continuing process in which more and more we put off the old man, and put on the new. The young Christan puts off his old life, but as God continues His work in him he recognises more of the old life that he has to put off. So the putting off of the old life occurs again and again even if he continues on faithfully. But many sadly allow the old life to re-exert itself. Thus once again they have to put off their old lives. Thus the aorist does not refer to a once-for-all event. And this is made clear in verse 25. There we learn of sins which we must constantly deal with. We must put them off again and again. This is the practical reality. And as we grow in knowledge we will put off more and more. The present infinitive would not have indicated this. Incidentally I did not have these verses in mind in my post which was a general one, the aim of which was to briefly explain Greek tenses to anyone interested.. |
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4 | Is sinless perfection possible on earth? | 1 John 1:8 | biblicalman | 228740 | ||
Further to my note on Ephesians 4.24 ff. I omitted to point out that of course our initial putting off of the old man and putting on of the new was when we became Christians. 'If any man is in Christ he is a new creature. Old things have passed away, everything has become new'. (2 Cor 5.17) It is thus a putting off of the old and the putting on of the new 'which in the likeness of God is created in righteousness and true holiness'. But as Paul indicates in Eph 4.24 ff this experience has to be repeated. Not the new creation which is of course permanent, but the putting into practise of what that new creation involves. In the same way having died with Christ and risen with Him we have to continually reckon on the fact. |
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