Subject: God love the senner but hate the sin |
Bible Note: You have the free will teachings of mankind not of scripture. This is why I pointed you to scripture to help you understand what God has to say on the matter not the free will thinkers of mankind's point of view. If there is any validity to your argument, then you should be able to provide scripture proof of such. The fact is, we both need to be right! It's not about me being right and you being wrong or you being right and me being wrong. It's important that you and I both are right and to be so we have to conform to the word of God not our own opinions. Our opinions MUST conform to the word of God or they are pointless and useless and only lead others into a false understanding of God and what His word teaches. You say "And I'm pretty confident that God has not forced you to obey Him... which ultimately means His authority to rule over you is limited by your own free will." Here is your fallacy in the doctrine you teach and believe. If the statement above were true as you teach and believe, then you contradict your own teaching by saying " God has given each of us the right to choose whether we want to obey Him or not, which naturally places a limitation on His authority to rule." Do you see how you defeat your own argument on the matter? If it is God who gives us the "right" as you say to choose, then where does that place your free will? If God has any limitation as you teach, then God Himself must be the one who places the limitation on Himself and it is not your "free will" that limits Him. Understand? So as the scriptures teach, your "free will" is not as free as you and others would have us believe. The scriptures teach us we are slaves to sin as I have pointed out to you already. Therefore, your "free will" is not free to do anything but choose sin. This is what the natural man has chosen and is enslaved to. Note again what it says in Roman 8:7 (NASB) "because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so" NOT EVEN ABLE TO DO SO! What free will is there then? And again, what does it say in Matthew 11:27 (NASB) ""All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him." nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him! So, where does this leave your free will? You say "I understand God's RIGHT to rule, but that doesn't mean He will use coercion or manipulation or threats of violence to enforce that right." I would encourage you to read through the old testament! Again, His word is much different then what you teach! Steve |