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NASB | Matthew 22:32 'I AM THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, AND THE GOD OF ISAAC, AND THE GOD OF JACOB'? He is not the God of the dead but of the living." |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | Matthew 22:32 'I AM THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, AND THE GOD OF ISAAC, AND THE GOD OF JACOB'? He is not the God of the dead, but of the living." [Ex 3:6] |
Subject: purgatory is it true? |
Bible Note: Emmaus: What conerns me about this post is that you have obviously harvested these quotes from secondary sources which quote the originals themselves. It does not seem like you to quote single sentences and what appears to be clauses within other sentences outside their context in order to support your point. Surely you do not believe that Luther and Bullinger (the author of the Second Helvetic Confession) held to the Mariology that 21st century Catholics do today. I appreaciate the source references so I can go look these up myself and discover what the contexts of these snippets are. I would hope, if my presumption turns out to be true that the positions of the Reformers were indeed quoted out of context, that you will denounce the authors who perpetrated such dishonesty. Likewise, if I find that I have been mistaken in my assessment of the Reformers on Mary, as well as the unbroken apostolic tradition you claim for the Mariology to which you adhere, I will acknowledge my error as well. I would like to start off with Irenaeus' work, "Against Heresies." The quote you give is found in Book 3, chapter 22 of this massive work. The title of this chapter is "Christ Assumed Actual Flesh, Conceived and Born of the Virgin." The chapter rebuts a heresy present in the church regarding the nature of Christ, not the nature of Mary. And while there is a comparison between Mary's obedience and Eve's disobedience, nowhere does it state that Mary is a "second Eve." The comparison is not between Eve's motherhood and Mary's motherhood, but a contrast between Eve's disobedience leading Adam to commit the original sin and Mary's obedience leading to the birth of the "second Adam," the sinless Son of God. You can read this part of Irenaeus at this link: http://www.ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-01/anf01-60.htm I would also encourage you to use the "search" feature of your browser to find every reference to Mary in this work. What does this early church father have to say about her? Not much, except for what we see in the Bible. While not directly stating it, there is also implication that Mary did not remain a virgin after the birth of Jesus (even though this issue is not central to any Protestant concerns regarding Mary veneration, so it isn't a debate worth having, in my opinion). Therefore, we really do not see anything in Irenaeus which would suggest an apostolic tradition regarding Mary that is not found in Scripture. Feel free to examine it for yourself, though. The work is huge, but there are some gems in there from my brief perusal of it. --Joe! |