Results 641 - 660 of 678
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
641 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 66177 | ||
Good morning! Let's look at it this way...Are you married? Consider that we are married to the Holy Spirit and those intimate times we can let our hairdown, we can share those thoughts and feelings we can't share with others. We can cry, we can become vulnerable..here we are open and uninhibited by the restrictions of 'corporate'prayer. When I was a new born believer, corporate prayer seemed hard to me. I did not feel like I was part of it but merely an observer. I would try to join but my faith was not developed enough to pray boldly and confidently with others. I personally was shy and self concious that I would 'pray wrong'. And yes there were times when I knew I was not in the right spirit and chose not to pray. But you must search inward with those questions, and repent if it is rebellion. Yes, I recognize (inward witness, not feeling) His presence all the time now and pray with boldness and confidence that he hears me. I feel His presence often. We are a vessel for Him to work and speak through and the less there is of me, the more there is of Him. I heard a sermon by Mark Chirona that really impressed my thinking and may help you understand. In the Song of Solomon the Shulamite begins by expressing My beloved is mine and I am His. She progresses to I am my beloved and he is mine. She ends with the love Christ has for us.. I AM BY BELOVED'S. When we get there our pride and fears vanish in light of the love of God. I hope this helps! |
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642 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 66055 | ||
Hi Ken, Sorry for taking so long to respond. Yes..there have been 'dry'. These to me are times when the emotions do not register the Holy Spirit's presence, but as I have grown in faith in my relationship those times are rare now. I am aware of the Holy Spirit's presence constantly now. My prayer life has changed a lot also in that I go to the Father less and less asking for provision (family, finance, health etc.) but spend a lot more time praising Him for the provision Jesus provided already. God bless. |
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643 | Which teaching | Matt 14:29 | gracefull | 65875 | ||
Hi Meredith and Pastor Glenn. Exactly, he stopped looking at Jesus and started looking at the waves. When we stop seeing Jesus and start looking at our circumstances and how big they seem and how imposible everyone tells us the situation is... we forget Jesus and how He came forth from the grave in power and handed that power to us and said now you go in my name... I heard a pastor say one time we have to look at God until He becomes bigger to us than the mountain.. then when we speak to the mountain it will go. As long as the mountain is bigger to us than God, our faith is weak. |
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644 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65628 | ||
We will but at the moment I will move myself to the thread about God's sovereignty verses is promises. I don't have a lot of time and this thread has been overly time comsuming for me. Regardless of each of our conclusions in such research this will be very good for newcomers to see the comparison. Your sister in christ, |
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645 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65627 | ||
Much better.. It is a shame we could not have started out this way! God bless |
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646 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65626 | ||
Thank you for this compassionate concern for me. I do appreciate it and this is how we should respond to one another when in disagreement. this allows the 'defenses' to come down to a degree where we can keep open communications. We will talk more, I am sure. God bless..No I have not read New Creation Realities but will consider reading it. If it teaches the Word I should not have a problem reading it. God bless |
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647 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65625 | ||
Hi Tim, I know there is another thread on this now but for the sake of not losing this communication and not addressing your statements, I want to post here.. In Gethsemane Jesus knew the will of the Father. He knew exactly where He was headed, and every bit of His humanity screamed noooooo. His prayer was to be released from this call if at all possible, not I do not know your will. Yes He was asking if there was another way, but He KNEW the way. I believe this is very different from sending a shotgun prayer with nothing specific to aim at. Please understand I know there are many times we really are not sure what God wants especially in our baby walk and we have very little Word indwelling in us and our prayer life is weak we pray this kind of prayer a lot. I also know for myself when I was a baby and praying this way my faith was in His mercy to watch out for me in my ignorance, and there was no faith in His specific provision. Now that I have grown up some, my prayer life has changed. When I pray and am uncertain I ask Him to show me His will in His Word so I can focus faith on His promise. There really is a huge difference. Many believers never grow up in the Word past thes scatter prayers because of the effort of developing this deeper relationship with the Lord. They are taught we can't know the 'mysteries' of God.. But the Word says the Holy spirit came to lead us into ALL truth. Word of Faith people believing for things not specifically promised. There are promises regarding our financial provision, our health, our spiritual growth... I think financial believing seems to be the rub with most WOF opposers. How can I believe for a new car when there is no scripture for it? As I mature in my relationship and God's will for my life are developing in me, the Holy Spirit reveals how God wants me to pray, and what to pray for. Others around me will not understand the faith that speaks and calls things that be not as though they are, and I believe if you couple this with the fact that they do not accept this truth of the revealed will of God, they are often jealous of the faith and resent it.'My Father never gave me a fatted calf!' I hope this helps you see what I see... May God bless you Tim with the wisdon and understanding of His will... |
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648 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65582 | ||
The question is.. do we have the capability to know His will? Confidence Ask according to His will If we KNOW He hears us We KNOW we have the requests... Let me paraphrase what I hear.. Our confidence in God (trust, boldness to believe despite our circumstances) that if we ask anything in agreement with His will , and we know (have confidence that He hears us because we are in Jesus) WE KNOW we have the requests that We asked. I agree! We are to read and meditate in prayer for guidance from the Holy Spirit and He the Sprit will REVEAL, ENLIGHTEN, SEND DEVINE UNDERSTANDING to us. Steve, isn't this walk personal? Has God shown you in His word provision that maybe someone else has not seen? He revealed to me His Deliverance provision, while many around me remained addicted and did not understand. When I shared my testimony some believed I was of the devil because I said God spoke to me. If God can't be trusted to keep His word, If keeping His word is optional, how can we have confidence? |
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649 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65579 | ||
I agree that we should not strife, and I apologize if this has come to that. In defense of mysef Justme, please go back and read the first 9 entries to this thread. When I joined this thread, (the first time on this forum) I assumed this was an open forum for discussion of various interpretations of scripture. My direction to what I believe is a good site for some objective research was met with very strong opposition as if any other interpretations than your own should be avoided. I do not think this is the correct method this forum should address difference of beliefs. I expected (naively maybe) some one to read and come back with, 'I do or do not agree with this or that and I base my belief on these scriptures. What do you think?' No, as I pointed out to Ed in a lenghty post, I am not interested in the opinions of men against other men. If you guys are not willing to look at other interpretations and address them scripturally, why are you here? People with all types of teaching some correct, some incorrect are going to visit here with questions. To attack and say this is cultish without being willing to really listen to why they believe what they believe and then share scripture to hopefully correct error and maybe even learn yourselves where you are wrong. Herein we all grow up in the knowledge of Him. People who fear this type of aggresive opposition will leave taking their thought with them. I am ending my association with this thread unless someone wants to discuss it's original purpose... At which point I believe a new thread should be started with the rules of conduct respected. This issue here for me is what is the goal of this forum, to share, to learn, or does a select few want theire responses to be accepted without question. This is not unity, this is control, and control never brings a change of heart. Even God knew this so He sent his son to give us the 'choice' to resume relationship with Him. In Jesus |
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650 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65577 | ||
Pastor Glenn, this is the main problem with Ed and Hank's argument. They have already thrown out the baby with the bath water and we are asking them to retrieve both inorder to extract the baby. But the heresy claims and fear promotions have many people unwilling to even search out the truth for themselves. They simply accept the fear laden warnings and sit down to be taught quietly in accordance to the 'traditions'. Thus many in the the body of Christ is weak and still on milk. The meat by many pastors and teachers if refused to the baby. The baby will eventually become content into remaining a baby or will take off on their own seeking the meat. As I told mbooker, we do not have to fear seeking truth. Faith in the Holy Spirit's promise to lead us and guide us tells me to lay down my fears, lay down my presuppositions, and be willing to let go of traditions that bind us, and listen, pray, read.. Maybe they will hear, maybe they will not... Bless you |
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651 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65576 | ||
Please forgive this long letter, but I truly want to see if we can establish a foundation for communication on a scriptural level. Last but not least, yes the metaphysics believe they can create their positve circumstances by their own positive thoughts, and speakin them into existence. But this godless philosophy does not make the WOF teachings untrue. I simply means Satan can counterfeit God's word. (Ipresented this possibility before and was not responded to) Satan uses the scripture that Jesus died for the sins of the world to create his religion of Unitarian Universalism. Do you believe Satan counterfeits everthing God does? He counterfeits the gifts, he counterfeits salvation...Why would he not counterfeit the teaching that 'Faith filled words spoken from the revealed truth of God's word produces results in the natural rhelm'? Would this not be the ideal counterfeit for the scripture Matthew 17:20 but exclude faith in God but insert faith in self, you then have metaphysics. But the distortion of the truth does not make the truth not truth. Without a scriptural teaching/sharing along with enlightenment (the Word without the enlightenment of the Holy Spirit cannot be understood. It is like the Supreme Courts 'interpretaion' of the Constitution apart from the authors). Maybe now you and Hank will understand why we are not communicating. I hope so. In Jesus P.S. I do not have time to proof read this so please forgive mispelled words and any other gramatical error. |
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652 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65575 | ||
Good morning Hank. I noted two pf the papers your reccomended and will try to find and read them. The statement Hank made that E. W. Kenyon 'majored' in metaphysics is either on page 61 or 63. I do not have the book here...conveniently preempting any of the above "proof' which would influence the reader to assume the next statements prove his earlier assertion. This is wrong,and highlights my point that Hank wrote his book in a more sensationalistic fassion rather than taking the teachings themselves and challenging them scripturally. Why don't you see a problem with that? You said "All we have is the testimony of witnesses and the evidence of his fruit since Kenyon died in 1948, the testimony of witnesses verify his philosophy as metaphysical. The evidence of his fruit shows he had metaphysical thoughts. Everyone can't be wrong. I think the proof os strong enough to to conclude Kenyon was very much influenced by metaphysical Philosophy." Here is the problem I have with what you are saying... All we have are testimony of eye witnesses and the evidence of his fruit.. I submit that we have his teachings in his own words to compare to scripture. Any conclusion based on the testimony of men is very weak in light of scripture. Did not the Pharasees have 'eye-witnesses against Jesus and against the ressurection?(the soldiers were paid to say they fell asleep and the body was stolen. Then we have the apostles eyewitness account.. one mans word against another and the apostles were mere fishermen testifying against the entire Jewish religious community. What made the difference? Was it the testimony? Or was it the Holy Spirit confirming the testimony of the Apostles? Fruit.. is this E.W.Kenyon's fruit you are speaking of or the fruit of others? Are you to be judged for the fruit of your students or the fruit of you congregation? Certainly some will manifest good fruit but this is based solely on their own walk with God. Are we speaking of his fruit or the fruit of others? Everyone can't be wrong ---These are not everyone, they are opposers. To have a fair hearing you have to give the defense a fair shot. I believe Kenyon's own writings, His own study comparative to scripture that 'without doubt' proves what you say. Let me explain something about myself and this may help you understand where I am coming from. I grew up in a small town and recognized the hypocrosy of the local religious people at a very young age. I came to the conclusion that their words disguised their motives most of the time, so had little regard for the words of people. At the crisis turning point of my life, I came to the conclusion that God and His Word were the only truth and God had only one ulterior motive, His love for me. I made the decision to trust Him totally and believe what His Word spoke to my heart by the Holy Spirit. For me, everything else is superficial. I did not come to believe what I believe based on my opinion of E.W. Kenyon or Kenneth Copeland, or John Hagee. I heard their teachings, and searched the scriptures and believe what the Holy Spirit has revealed to my spirit as truth. These men are mere men and all of them, including Hank and Charles Farah and James M. Kinnebrew are fallable and only as reliable as their motives which only God knows totally. We assume we know the motives of others but God alone knows the heart. Some with the purist sweetest actions can have very impure motives. Man judges by outward appearance, God looks at the heart. (this does not speak to mere physical attributes). You and Hank have tried to convince from from the writing of men against other men and the writings of Hank H are biased because nowhere is the accused represented. This is why I like the website I reccomended because this person has taken the accusations and laid them side by side to scripture rather than trying to convince by choosing incomplete statements of the accused. Rather than the old YES IT IS-NO IT ISN'T approach. This is why you and Hank and I have had an impass on this. The very first statements were not, "we don't agree with these teachings but let's take a look at the teachings and compare scripture for scripture." Instead you both took the stance of a bully saying 'this is cultish and they do not serve the same God we serve and they are wrong because Hank and others have said so.' This is the attitude of the mainstream denominations. We are your leaders so follow us without us showing you from the scriptures why, and sadly many have followed their leaders blindly because they were to lazy or felt incompetent to search the truth for themselves. Someone in this thread said it all.. a true Berean. A leader/child of God who concludes their beliefs but is unwilling or unable to teach why from scripture should remain silent on a subject. Not bring division in the body by accusing the brethren. Continued on nest post.. Your sister in Christ |
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653 | Where was Jesus for 3 days after death? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65495 | ||
Hi Roger, ignore my latter post. In my haste I misunderstood your respose as a question. Bless you |
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654 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65477 | ||
Ed, Hank... If Hank H's statement "E.W Kenyon majored in metaphysics." is not true, as I believe Hank stated in an earlier post.. Why would you not be bothered that he so comfortably accused (defamed) a fellow human being without ANY substantiating proof? Hank, even you who do not claim to called to expose heresy knows this is not true... This does not upset your confidence in his motives? Do you not realize motive is critical in interpretaion? Your sister in the Lord |
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655 | Where was Jesus for 3 days after death? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65474 | ||
Roger Wilco... Wow! What a relief to get back on the subject of this thread. You have asked a very insiteful question that I am surprised was not asked originally. Why is it important? I have to leave the forum today but will try to post some tomorrow. There are quite a few other scriptures that make an argument for Jesus paying the full penalty of sin (spiritual death)for us. Although some do not accept this idea I believe it is important for believers to at least look at the scripture and allow the Holy Spirit to direct them to truth as He promised He would. If we see the full price Jesus paid and the Holy Spirit burns this truth into our Spirit our relationship with Him will change. We can no longer take sin lightly, we can no longer consider soul winning an option, our love will be increased dramatically. Besides, if it is truth God wants us to know and fear and tradition should not keep us from searching for truth. Since I can't stay look at Psalm 188. I believe it is very descriptive of the anguish of a sinner seperated from God for eternity. I believe this could easily be describing the eternal punishment the sinner can expect. I also believe it can be the expression of a believer who has known God's presence and has now fallen into sin and is being chastised.(having the SENSE of eternal seperation) Please comment on your impression of this Psalm. |
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656 | In Gen 1.26, God refers to us and our.. | Gen 1:26 | gracefull | 65393 | ||
God the Father, God the Word-Jesus John 1:1 God the Holy Spirit Genesis 1:2 the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. They are all there and they are all busy! |
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657 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65390 | ||
Hi Tim: The availability of knowledge of God's will is what is in question, not the fact that as humans at different levels of growth and relationship will sometimes not hear. But if we are taught to believe the knowledge of His will is not available we will not even try to find out. This I believe is both tragic and sad. Our Father's provision is so great and the price was so high. In James 4:16 James says 'Now you rejoice in your boasting: all such rejoicing is evil. Therefor to him that knoweth to do good and doeth it not, to him it is sin. I believe James is speaking to folks who are not asking God for his will based on verse 17. John 5:14 This is probably one of my favorite verses and one that keeps me aware of the need to stay in communication with God through the Holy Spirit. Here again we are agreeing with God and believing, not asking God to agree with ur OR asking praying a shotgun prayer hoping something will hit. We must not forget we have an enemy and if our faith is not focused on the Word of promise we are vulnerable to the attack of doubt which robs us of our faith. The Word produces faith, Understanding God's will gives us boldness to stand in the time of trouble or temptation. This issue is so important because if believers only understood how urgent it is to seek God's revelation of His truth we would not wait until we are attacked to try to find out! Just like He told Paul he would go to Rome and suffer. Paul knew what was ahead and chose (bound by love) to go. 1 Cor. 4:19 Paul did not have long range knowledge of God's plan and will but when he did move he knew it was God's will. We may not always know in advance. Our walk is a daily faith walk.. Sufficient to the day are the troubles thereof. It is a growth walk. God is drawing us, training us, and just as we see the progression of faith from Adam to Abraham to David To Jesus, so is our walk. God does not send us to Goliath before we face the lion and bear at home... Blessings! |
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658 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65374 | ||
Hank: The Lords prayer was, Our Father, who art in heaven hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come, thy will be done... Where is the statement "If it be thy will?" In the garden did our Lord asking what the will of God was? Was there ever a time that He did not know God's will? Or was he asking "Is there another way?" I do not see here where there is uncertainty about what God's will in either of these scriptures. " If it is unnecessary for mortal man to pray thy will be done... This should now be clear, Our right ot choose God's will and plan for our lives. God made provision, but we have to choose to accept (agree with His Word) to receive it. This IS why we would pray Thy will be done...Not "If it be thy will". And we will face our own crises of life "gethsemene" when His will revealed is hard to take and we may ask,"God, is there another way, nevertheless..." but when we pray this prayer we will surely already know where God wants us to go. What do you think Jesus meant? "Show me a scripture, even a hint where mortal man can tell a sovereign God to do anything agains His will." This is an assumption on your part, and by no means a statement I made. The New Testament covenant IS God's will for our lives. His promises are freely given and He is not going to 'snatch them back on a whim'. Do not insert your own preconceived conclusions as if they are mine. This is wrong and you should know that. Pray without ceasing... My understanding is that Prayer is communication with God. Agreed? Jesus died for, and the Holy Spirit came to restore that severed relationship. Prayer is talking to and listening to God. Remember the Holy Spirit came to 'show us all things". God is not keeping His will a secret. It just takes lots of prayer (see above) and lots of meditation of His Word. 1 Corinthians 2:10-12 But God hath revealed them (mysteries) unto us by His Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea the deep things of God. For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is of God: that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. |
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659 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65361 | ||
What did God say to Abraham? Hebrews 6:1-14 For when God made a promise to Abraham. because He could swear by no greater, He swore by Himself, saying... John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word. The Word was with God and the Word was God. The Word became flesh and dwelt among men... God does what He pleases...See Ephesians 1:4-6 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestined us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ himself, according to the GOOD PLEASURE OF HIS WILL, to the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us ACCEPTED in the beloved, God did do what He pleased. It pleased Him to redeem us by His son and give us great and precious promise..Which we receive by faith... 1.Are you saying that God in His sovereignty has not obligated Himself to honour His Word? If He is obligated to keep His word are we still to aproach Him doubting His integrity. "God, I know you said this but I don't presume to expect you to keep you word unless you really want to." Where would that leave all who have believed and received by faith the promise of our eternal destiny? Please explain how you believe the believer (or sinner) should approach God's Word? If I don not believe God's word it will not profit me through salvation or deliverance or any of the other promises. I did not Say His word was not true if I did not believe it, but His promises (His provision through Christ) is only available to one who believes and receives by faith. For everyone else there is only the assurance of eternal damnation. I have Never said God is not sovereign, but If you believe He can act in contradition to His word I submit that you do not know Him very well. "God is not a man that He should lie." He gave us His Word so we could know His will and so we could walk in it's straight path with confidence. If He is not obligated to keep His WORD then what confidence would we have in any of His promises. He did this by His SOVEREIGN Choice. God has never and will never break His covenant. " God said it, I believe it, that settles it". The boldness I have comes from the faith I have in Jesus blood as my sin offering. God gave His word, I choose to believe His word, that settles the matter for me. Hebrews 4:16 Come blodly to the throne of grace fo find mercy and grace in the time of need. You asked..where I got my belief concerning receiving God's already provided provision by faith.. 2Peter 1:3-4 According as His divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue, whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. ?? What did Christ NOT provide through the atonement and ressurection?( a scriptural answer here please, rather than a snide inuendo) Hebrews 10:18-20 We have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus. Ed, I will ask you nicely to stop jumping to conclusions based on your preconceived ideas of what I believe. You are taking my statements and inserting false assumptions about what I mean. I mean what I say and there is no hidden agenda. I am trying to communicate with you, but communication is not possible with you always approaching everything I say with this assumed conclusion. At the beginning of this thread I stated my faith in Jesus Christ but you continue to respond to my post as an enemy. I hope you lay down this ofensive stance. In Christ Jesus |
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660 | Did Jesus suffer in hell when he died? | Luke 23:46 | gracefull | 65340 | ||
Steve, you are absolutely correct. May I quote from a WOF teacher on this, not to glorfy the teaching, but to demonstrate that the accusation that WOF teachers all disregard the Word for self desires. John 15:7-8 " If you abide in me and My Words abide in you, YOU shall ask what YOU will and it shall be done unto you. Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit: and so shall you be my diiples." " It is not only committing the Word to memory, which is valuable, but it is letting that Word become an integral part of our beings. It lives in us." I believe when we receive the Word as alive and transforming(which it is) we begin to recognize the will of God more and more and follow our flesh and soulish tendencies less and less. In Jesus, |
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