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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | is tounges a sign of holyghost | Bible general Archive 2 | DocTrinsograce | 131797 | ||
Hi, Ed... Yes, I agree that it appears throughout history, both in and out of the church. I've done a bit of digging in my books and electronic library. I was rather surprised at some of what I found. Let me summarize: After the time of the Apostles, tongues appears again in the second century with a convert by the name of Montanus. His teachings -- which would be recognizable by us today -- gained significant acceptance. Probably the most influential of Montanists was Tertullian of Carthage (about 160 AD). Ultimately its adherents split from the church. The rise of Montanism that originated the great synods of the church. In addition, the Montanists insistence on what they called "new prophecy" also gave the church the impetus to establish the canon of scripture -- a closed canon. By the time of John Chrysostom Montanism (360 AD) had been discounted and all but disappeared. It was Chrysostom who attested to the fact that speaking in languages had stopped altogether even among fringe groups where suspicion had held that they occurred. Justin Martyr, though he he states that he had "heard of prophetic gifts," does not even mention tongues. In fact, Dr. George Cutten of Colgate University, took a close look at any historical instances of this speaking in tongues. After thorough research, it was Cutten’s conclusion that in the ancient church at least, the church of the fathers, there was not one well-attested instance of any person who exercised speaking in tongues or even pretended to exercise it. However, outside of Montanism I did find a reference where Irenaeus in the second century claimed that he had encountered people who spoke all sorts of languages. The long centuries passed on into the Middle Ages. During this time there was so much stuff going on that was superstitious, mystical, inexplainable, awesome, weird, and monastic its hard ferreting out instances of New Testament spirituality, let alone anything about the gifts! The next thing that seems somewhat verifiable is around the early 1500's with Francis Xavier who claimed to have the ability to speak to people of India. Urbane VIII sanctioned this claim, which seems interesting in view of the things going on in Spain at the time. After the Reformation marked a great burst of vitality and hunger for truth. In this period there are a few incidents of "the ecstatic and the uncontrollable." It pops up among the Anabaptists, Munsterites, Albigenses, etc. It blossoms, however, in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. During the founding days of America the Pilgrim fathers, Puritan leaders, Baptist preachers, Presbyterian divines, and Methodist laymen did not at all indulge in these practices. It continues to predominate outside of orthodox Christian circles. Note: This is not speculation, provocation, or interpretation. All I did was dig around in church history for glosia, as suggested. Therefore, if anyone has issues with what I found, please search out the sources and examine them for yourself. :-) It has been a long week and I'm tired of thinking for tonight! |
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2 | Other gifts throughout history? | Bible general Archive 2 | warsaw | 131818 | ||
Excellent reply Doc! There seems to be such an emphasis on “speaking in tongues” in the discussion of spiritual gifts. Have you read anything that shows historical evidence of the “other” spiritual gifts consistently taking place throughout history? Your brother in Christ, Mike |
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3 | Other gifts throughout history? | Bible general Archive 2 | DocTrinsograce | 131838 | ||
Yes, that's an interesting point. As I was digging around I found references to the gifts, but an almost complete absence of reference to tongues. I even discovered that the Eastern Orthodox Church actually recognizes tongues as a valid gift of the Spirit. However, they qualify it everywhere as being so unimportant as being worthy of dismisal. Where it seems to pop up is when people get interested in flash and dazzle rather than truth. Our God is very real and our faith is very true. We ought not be surprised when He does things. Nevertheless, the most awesome, mind-boggling, incredibly gift of God is salvation! That should continually blow our minds! | ||||||
4 | Other gifts throughout history? | Bible general Archive 2 | EdB | 131841 | ||
doc You it may also interest you to know the Roman Catholic church recognizes tongues as a valid gift and I believe take a similar position of that of the Eastern Orthodox. I have also poised this question to many within the Pentecostal perspective and it sadden me with their answer. The hypothetical question, ‘Is we have two identical churches in one an Evangelist prays and one hundred are saved. In the other the Evangelist prays and a man in wheel chair that everyone in town knows is totally paralyzed stands and walks. Which church would have the biggest attendance the next night?’ To a person everyone has answered the church in which the man walked. That deeply saddens me. Salvation is the most important thing that can happen in anyone’s life. It is also the only thing that will go on for eternity. The healing of the man will only last until the man does die, however his salvation will last for eternity. Scripture tells us all of heaven rejoices when one is saved yet doesn’t even mention what happens when someone is healed. We are physical people and refuse to allow ourselves to think spiritually, yet our hope, our future and our God are all exist in the spiritual realm. EdB Doc you then stated, "Where it seems to pop up is when people get interested in flash and dazzle rather than truth." This is my biggest problem with the gifts of the spirit no matter which. It seems people lose focus on what is important, soon the gifts beocme the central focus instead of God. Also many use the gifts as an attempt to provide proof for their faith. Yet the very definition faith is holding fast to something you can not prove but know to be true nonetheless. |
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