Results 1 - 8 of 8
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | What exactly must a person to be saved? | Bible general Archive 1 | sniper | 79639 | ||
inhisname, You have sparked an interesting debate. You have a radical view, but I see it as a logical extension of a view that starts illogically. Over my time here on the Forum I have seen many take the view that obedience is not necessary for salvation and that good works are only possible because God sparks the nonbeliever. The extreme to whch you have gone is only the logical extension of that. I think that you can see that the Bible requires men to obey God, so you must rethink your position so that it can be truly Biblical. God bless. sniper |
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2 | What exactly must a person to be saved? | Bible general Archive 1 | inhisname | 79676 | ||
You are nice to bless me, and I am a radical to some. You think my position is extreme? Maybe. You are right that the Bible uses the word obey but God is Sovereign. Don't you see that faith and works don't go together and faith without works is what saves? God makes me I don't make myself. Isn't that the idea of Him shaping the clay (Romans 9)? If I start teaching my family to work then I am telling them not to trust in God. He saves me by faith alone and by nothing else. He gives me faith and He renews me and He gives me repentance and he gives me obedience. He determined my path from the beginning. So I can't take credit and I won't. If you see me and think I am obeying I'm not. Like an invisible force field God is drawing me and controlling me. That's God. If works come then God is doing them. All I do is nothing, because God does it all. Read about the teaching of what is called election. Then you will see the truth. |
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3 | What exactly must a person to be saved? | Bible general Archive 1 | Reformer Joe | 79694 | ||
"Don't you see that faith and works don't go together and faith without works is what saves?" Where in Scripture do you see that faith and works do not go together? Where do you see that a faith that doesn't result in works is what saves? "If I start teaching my family to work then I am telling them not to trust in God." That is 100 percent unbiblical. If you teach them to work in order to earn their way to heaven, that would indeed be telling them not to trust in God. But it would be a demonstration of faithlessness on your part to not train your children to be servants of God. True faith results in works. True faith leads to obedience. Anything else is a false, dead, non-saving faith. "He saves me by faith alone and by nothing else." Okay, but we are not saved by a faith that doesn't move us to obey. "He gives me faith and He renews me and He gives me repentance and he gives me obedience. " All true, but who does the obeying? IT ISN'T GOD. The love of Christ compels me. God is at work in me. God gets the glory for the renewed nature and the obedience. But God does not obey Himself; I obey God. "If you see me and think I am obeying I'm not. Like an invisible force field God is drawing me and controlling me." Scripture? "If works come then God is doing them." Scripture? "All I do is nothing, because God does it all." You know the question I am going to ask. --Joe! |
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4 | What exactly must a person to be saved? | Bible general Archive 1 | inhisname | 79717 | ||
Scripture? "Not of works that any should boast" You asked for Scripture and I gave it. I think we are very much alike. We both believe that a person cannot repent, do good, confess Christ, love, hope, sacrifice, etc so how do you not understand that I'm saying what you are saying. I'm not saying that Christians aren't different from sinners. Christians can't sin and they can't lose their salvation. This work of God is only possible with God's help all the way. He does it all. I answered your past post the way I did because I thought you were a believer in the Sovereign God. But now you say, "train your children to be servants of God." A true understanding of Scripture shows this is folly. God trains, God does, God moves. The unregenerate can't do anything spiritual, but the regenerate can do everything spiritual. Holy Spirit baptism brings instant salvation and knowledge through tongues and prophecy. The Bible is readable by the unregenerate but completely not understandable. But when given a new heart, the Holy Spirit did this, then reading brings understanding. Suddenly, miraculously, you start confessing and changing. blessings inhisname The truly born again can't DO sin. He therefore can only DO right. God is doing that! |
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5 | What exactly must a person to be saved? | Bible general Archive 1 | Reformer Joe | 79770 | ||
"Christians can't sin and they can't lose their salvation." I sin every day. 'But now you say, "train your children to be servants of God." A true understanding of Scripture shows this is folly.' Folly? Folly...where do we see a great deal of discussion of wisdom and folly? Oh, I know: Proverbs. "Train up a child in the way he should go, Even when he is old he will not depart from it." --Proverbs 22:6 So who is the foolish one for suggesting that we train our children to be servants of God? Let's see if any of the other thousands of Bible verses support such a "foolish" idea... "If it is disagreeable in your sight to serve the LORD, choose for yourselves today whom you will serve: whether the gods which your fathers served which were beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you are living; but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD." --Joshua 24:15 "These words, which I am commanding you today, shall be on your heart. You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise up. You shall bind them as a sign on your hand and they shall be as frontals on your forehead. You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates." --Deuteronomy 6:6-9 "Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord." --Ephesians 6:4 Yes, what a fool I am! :) "But when given a new heart, the Holy Spirit did this, then reading brings understanding." But such understanding is not automatic. There are plenty of Christians who disagree on what the Bible teaches. Both have the Holy Spirit, but they both can't be right. "The truly born again can't DO sin." So you are sinless? --Joe! |
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6 | What exactly must a person to be saved? | Bible general Archive 1 | inhisname | 79832 | ||
I did not mean to say you were a fool. I'm not sinless, I just don't practice it because I can't. I've got a new heart. Do you practice sin? If so, then you may not have a new heart. Do you know what changes the heart of man? A miraculous and supernatural intervention by the Holy Spirit. It is changed. Since salvation is comes even before a single thought of goodness, then how are works now necessary? You don't believe like some that it starts with faith and ends with works? I'm sorry for sounding offensive to you. |
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7 | What exactly must a person to be saved? | Bible general Archive 1 | Reformer Joe | 79862 | ||
"I did not mean to say you were a fool. " I am not bothered by that, so let's stick to the subject. Do the verses I quoted specifically tell us to train our children or not? --Joe! |
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8 | What exactly must a person to be saved? | Bible general Archive 1 | inhisname | 79978 | ||
There are too many other verses that teach God, first to last, does it all. So those verses must be interpreted in the light of them. You see? | ||||||