Results 1 - 4 of 4
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Isn't Jesus Christ the True Isael to who | John 15:1 | Ray | 14476 | ||
Hi KINDNESS, The marginal note for Jacob's name in my NASB Study Bible says "i.e. one who takes by the heel or supplants." So, supplanter would be an appropriate character trait for a person of that name. But when I say that he "earned" the name Israel for his wrestling match I don't necessarily mean that in a good sense. Jacob seems to be "forcing his way" into the blessings of God. The Genesis passage doesn't say who brought about the wrestling match, but I know that God will not strive or struggle with man forever. Hosea says that Judah is also unruly against God and Hosea 12:2 says, "The Lord also has a dispute with Judah, And will punish Jacob according to his ways; He will repay him according to his deeds. In the womb he took his brother by the heel, And in his maturity he contended with God. Yes, he wrestled with the *Angel and prevailed; *he wept and sought His favor." It goes on to give a message for us. Hosea 12:4b, "He found Him at Bethel, And there He spoke with us, Even the Lord, the God of hosts; The Lord is His name. Therefore, return to your God, Observe kindness and justice, And wait for your God continually." But I would like to go back to John 4:20 for I agree that it is through these people that the promised Messiah comes. This is the way that I interpret John 4:20; my personal copy for whatever its worth. " "Our fathers worshiped in this mountain, and You (people, the Jews) say that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship." Jesus said to her, "Woman, believe Me, an hour is coming when neither in this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. You worship what you do not know; I (and we) worship what I (and we) know, for salvation is from the Jews. But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be (His) worshipers. God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship Him in spirit and truth." Consider that for a while and get back with me. Later, Ray |
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2 | Isn't Jesus Christ the True Isael to who | John 15:1 | KINDNESS | 14480 | ||
Hi Ray, I did address that passage in one of my notes to you. It was nearly 30 years ago when I realized that God looks on the heart to find a true worshiper. Attitude seems to be a major part of worship. When I realized that location was not important but single mindedness and yeildedness was all important it changed my whole life. Rom.12:1,2 is the key to being in touch with the living God. We are channels through which the Lord can manifest Himself if we are yeilded and ready to serve Him and others by His power. John 17:17 seems to identify the "truth" for me. We must worship according to God's word for Him to receive it ,don't you think? That along withHeb. 4:12 and Phil.2:5 and following. True worship takes place whenever we are obedient to the word of God out of a heart of love and gratitude to God for His love,and mercy. Maybe Heb.13:15,16 is the key to worship. Ps 22:3 tells us that God inhabits the praises of His people. What do you make of that verse? Waiting to hear back from you. Later,Kindness | ||||||
3 | Isn't Jesus Christ the True Isael to who | John 15:1 | Ray | 14548 | ||
Hi KINDNESS, You have expressed some good thoughts and I appreciate your personal growth and praise of God. I see where you are coming from as far as the location of worship is concerned for John 4:20. I wanted to get back to it for there was more of interest for this discussion of the vine or Vine. I think we have agreed that Jacob is not the true Vine even with his name change to Israel. He is the same Jacob, hopefully changed after his struggle with the Angel, just as we are part of the new "Israel" when we accept the promises of God in faith. But we're just part of the body of Christ; we are branches and Jesus is the true Vine. It is when we capitalize Vine (at least in our minds) that we can know the Deity of Christ and can compare it to John 4:23, "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth;..." I wanted to go back to John 4:20 to look at it differently than you did. I suggest that you look at the "you" or "ye" of the KJ and the "we worship what we know" of the NASB, and the "We worship what We know" of the NKJ and see if we can, as you have written, "focus on the one true living God and Father of all who are born of God." The King James does not have a "people" or "Jews" in its copy. It is in italics for the NASB and NKJ showing that it is not in the Greek. Thus, I would capitalize the You and the We worship what We know, or even make it "I worship what I know". Do you see where I am coming from as far as seeing the true Vine? Your Romans 12 reference is a good one for comparison with John 4:20. The "You people say that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship" would relate well with Romans 12:5, "so we, who are many,*are one body in Christ*, and individually members one with another." I would love to talk with you about John 17:17 and the "truth" and also John 8:30 concerning knowing the "Truth" . But I think that these other things should be on a different posting so that others can enter in easier. May I suggest that you compose another posting so that you can get more of the thoughts of others on the forum. Lets stay with Israel and the Vine here. Later, Ray |
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4 | Isn't Jesus Christ the True Isael to who | John 15:1 | KINDNESS | 14622 | ||
Hi Ray, I never meant to say that Jacob was the true Vine. What I was saying was that the promises regarding the Kingdom that were given to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and their seed were ultimately given to and fulfilled in the Seed spoken of in Gal.3:16. And when Jesus Christ came He was the true Israel to whom all is given and to whom all the promises of God are given and fulfulled. Therefore it is not necessary for the nation of Israel to be restored in order for God to fulfill all His promises to Israel. Jesus Christ is the true and final Israel. He is the true Vine and in Him all the promises are Yes and Amen. He is the David who will reign on the throne forever etc. Do you agree with this??? I will submit another Q. about John 4:20. Look for it. Later, Kindness |
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