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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | purgatory is it true? | Matt 22:32 | Emmaus | 39314 | ||
Tim, 1 of 2 Citations as requested, but in two parts because it exceeds 5,000 characters. Emmaus As for the Marian doctrines so many reject, Luther, Calvin and Zwingli had somewhat different opinions. Mary as the New Eve, mother of all the living in Christ: "Mary is the mother of Jesus and the mother of us all. If Christ is ours , we must be where he is; and all that he has must be ours, and his mother is therefore ours also." Luther , Martin Luther’s Works (Weimar), 29:655:26-656:7 "We are the children of Mary" Luther , ibid,11:224:8 "The knot of Eve's disobedience was loosed by the obedience of Mary What the virgin Eve had bound in unbelief, the Virgin Mary loosed through faith." Irenaus (189 A.D.) Against Heresies. Immaculately Conceived "But the other conception, namely the infusion of the soul, is piously and suitably believed, was without any sin, so that while the soul was being infused, she would at the same time be cleansed from original sin and adorned with the gifts of God to recive the holy soul thus infused. And thus in the very moment in which she began to live, she was without all sin." Luther, Weimar edition of Martin Luther’s Works, (translation by William J Cole), Vol 4, 694 ”I firmly believe that Mary, according to the words of the gospel as a pure virgin brought forth for us the Son of God and in childbith and after childbirth remained forever a pure, intact virgin.” Ulrich Zwingli, Zwingli Opera(Zwingli’s Works), Corpus Reformatorum, Vol 1, 424 “I esteem immensely the Mother of God, the ever chaste immaculate virgin.” E. Stakemeier, De Mariologia Oecumenismo, K. Balic, ed., (Rome 1962), 456 "It was fitting that such a holy son have a holy mother." Zwingli , ibid Christ… was born of a most undefiled virgin." Zwingli, ibid Ever Virgin Mother of God "It is an article of faith that Mary is mother of the Lord and still a virgin." Luther , Weimar edition of Martin Luther’s Works, English translation edited by J. Pelikan (Concordia, St Louis), Vol 24, 107 "The Council (Ephesus) has not offered anything new to faith but has strengthened the old faith against the arrogance of Nestorius. This article of faith-that Mary is the Mother of God- is present in the Church and is not a new creation of the Council but the presentation of the Gospel and scriptures." "In this work whereby she was made the Mother of God, so many and such good things were given that no on can grasp them." Luther, Weimar edition of Martin Luther’s Works, English translation edited by J. Pelikan (Concordia, St Louis), Vol 7, 572 "Helvidius has shown himself too ignorant, in saying that Mary had several sons, because mention is made in some passages of the brothers of Christ." Calvin, who here followed the traditional catholic interpretation to mean cousins or relatives. Bernard Leeming, “protestants and Our lady”, Marian Library Studies, January 1967, p 9 "Elizabeth called Mary Mother of the Lord, because the unity of the person in the two natures of Christ was such that she could have said that the mortal man engendered in the womb of Mary was at the same time the eternal God." John Calvin, Calvini Opera (Calvins’ Works) (Braunshweig-Berlin, 1863-1900), Vol 45, 35 " It cannot be denied that God in choosing and destining Mary to be the Mother of his Son, granted her the highest honor." Calvin, Calvini Opera (Calvins’ Works) (Braunshweig-Berlin, 1863-1900), Vol 45, 348 "I firmly believe that Mary, according to the words of the gospel as a pure Virgin brought forth for us the Son of God and in childbirth and after childbirth forever remained a pure, intact Virgin." Ulrich Zwingli, Zwingli Opera(Zwingli’s Works), Corpus Reformatorum, Vol 1, 424 Assumption "There can be no doubt that the Virgin Mary is in heaven. How it happened we do not know." Luther Weimar edition of Martin Luther’s Works, (translation by William J Cole), Vol 10, 268 "Mary's sacrosanct body was borne by angels to heaven." Heinrich Bullinger ( Cranmmer's brother in law and successor to Zwingli), Thomas O’Meara, Mary in Protestant and Catholic Theology (New York: Sheed and Ward, 1956), p 178-9 |
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2 | purgatory is it true? | Matt 22:32 | Reformer Joe | 39535 | ||
Emmaus: What conerns me about this post is that you have obviously harvested these quotes from secondary sources which quote the originals themselves. It does not seem like you to quote single sentences and what appears to be clauses within other sentences outside their context in order to support your point. Surely you do not believe that Luther and Bullinger (the author of the Second Helvetic Confession) held to the Mariology that 21st century Catholics do today. I appreaciate the source references so I can go look these up myself and discover what the contexts of these snippets are. I would hope, if my presumption turns out to be true that the positions of the Reformers were indeed quoted out of context, that you will denounce the authors who perpetrated such dishonesty. Likewise, if I find that I have been mistaken in my assessment of the Reformers on Mary, as well as the unbroken apostolic tradition you claim for the Mariology to which you adhere, I will acknowledge my error as well. I would like to start off with Irenaeus' work, "Against Heresies." The quote you give is found in Book 3, chapter 22 of this massive work. The title of this chapter is "Christ Assumed Actual Flesh, Conceived and Born of the Virgin." The chapter rebuts a heresy present in the church regarding the nature of Christ, not the nature of Mary. And while there is a comparison between Mary's obedience and Eve's disobedience, nowhere does it state that Mary is a "second Eve." The comparison is not between Eve's motherhood and Mary's motherhood, but a contrast between Eve's disobedience leading Adam to commit the original sin and Mary's obedience leading to the birth of the "second Adam," the sinless Son of God. You can read this part of Irenaeus at this link: http://www.ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-01/anf01-60.htm I would also encourage you to use the "search" feature of your browser to find every reference to Mary in this work. What does this early church father have to say about her? Not much, except for what we see in the Bible. While not directly stating it, there is also implication that Mary did not remain a virgin after the birth of Jesus (even though this issue is not central to any Protestant concerns regarding Mary veneration, so it isn't a debate worth having, in my opinion). Therefore, we really do not see anything in Irenaeus which would suggest an apostolic tradition regarding Mary that is not found in Scripture. Feel free to examine it for yourself, though. The work is huge, but there are some gems in there from my brief perusal of it. --Joe! |
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