Results 1 - 8 of 8
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Studying O.T. is creating problems. | Genesis | skip | 84664 | ||
I am becoming increasingly baffled by God as He is portrayed in the O.T. Why did he condone slavery, polygamy, and war? If He is the God of love, why did He so ruthlessly destroy so many nations? Why did He want His holy temple to be a slaughterhouse? The number of animals sacrificed daily must have been mind-boggling. I love Jesus with deep gratitude and adoration, but I fear this God of the O.T. The more I study the O.T., the more wary I feel about God, and I know it shouldn't be that way. What am I doing wrong? Skip |
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2 | Studying O.T. is creating problems. | Genesis | itiswritten | 84665 | ||
Dear skip, Your problem is that you do not understand the Old Testament Scriptures and/or have a full understanding of your salvation. When you look at Genesis 1 and 2 you see creation as God had intended. His crowning glory was man. Man was at peace with all of creation and God also gave him a woman...a wife, so to speak, a helpmate. Every man, woman and child that has ever been born into this earth was in the genes of these two persons and they fell from grace. God had warned and tested the free will He gave them by saying they were free to eat the fruit of every tree of the garden EXCEPT for ONE. They disobeyed. Since we were all in their genes, we all fell and are part of that sinful nature. It is born in us all. This is evidenced in the very next story of Cain and Abel, it is evidenced in the story of Lamuel, it is evidenced in the tower of babel and it is evidenced in the story of Noah and the ark. But right from the beginning, God began to teach man about what it takes to cover sin and about what constitutes life. "The life is in the blood" (Gen.9:4, Lev. 17:11) As soon as Adam and Eve sinned, they covered themselves out of guilt and shame - but that was not acceptable to God. No, He covered them with animal skins. This means that the animal had to die to cover them. It required its blood as a substitute for their blood. The blood is all important. That is why Jesus had to die and shed his blood. Even though they were under a curse (Genesis 3) God immediately gives them hope in Genesis 3:15 with the promise of the seed of the woman who would be the perfect substitute. They did not understand then, but it was about the God-man, the Messiah, the Christ, God with us, Immanuel...the one and only perfect sacrifice who would shed his blood once for all time and be that substitute. Meanwhile, God did not institute slavery, polygamy or war...man in his fallen nature did that all by himself. And why did God destroy so many nations? In I Cor. 5:5-6 we see that a little leaven destroys the whole lump. Sin is that way. When God sent the Israelites into the Promised land, He did so only at a time when the Canaanites were fully ripe in idolatry and violence. He did not want them to be contaminated with it. They, because of their own disobedience, ever really destroyed them all and they DID become contaminated with the idolatry of those nations. If you go back to the beginning that is what God was doing with the Flood, and with the tower of babel. He separated us by languages and different cultures, mountains and rivers when he caused man in is many languages to flee from one another, because outside of obedience to Him, it would only make our rebellion and our cruelty all the more powerful if we could do this in unity. (read Genesis 11). Yes, His holy temple became a slaughterhouse. The reason for this is so we would recognize the stench of OUR SIN. If we did not sin, this would not have been required. Oh there is so much more. Suffice to say, the blood is the most important thing about our whole faith...the Blood of Jesus Christ and the entire Bible, Old Testament and New is all about the Blood that bought our eternal life. I hope this is helpful. Itiswritten. |
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3 | Studying O.T. is creating problems. | Genesis | FreeThinker | 84699 | ||
“Since we were all in their genes, we all fell and are part of that sinful nature. It is born in us all.” Adam and Eve and the Tree of Knowledge??? Did you ever wonder if that was like putting a 10 year old in a candy store alone and telling them not to eat any of it? It is quite interesting that two cavemen damned the whole human race. Everyone who followed had no chance. God also let a fallen angel lose on the earth to help this happen. Remember that the angels, even the fallen ones are far superior to humans. What chance did God give us? Then years later, God who could no longer stand the wicked ways of man, sent a flood to wipe them old, save for the family of Noah. What was the first thing Noah did when the floodwaters subsided. He grew a vineyard and got so drunk that he didn’t know what his son was doing to him. Genesis 9 20 And Noah began to be an husbandman, and he planted a vineyard: 21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent. 22 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without. 23 And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness. 24 And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him. 25 And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren. For those that do not know what is meant by this, may Leviticus 18:7-19 will help. 7 The nakedness of thy father, or the nakedness of thy mother, shalt thou not uncover: she is thy mother; thou shalt not uncover her nakedness. 8 The nakedness of thy father's wife shalt thou not uncover: it is thy father's nakedness. 9 The nakedness of thy sister, the daughter of thy father, or daughter of thy mother, whether she be born at home, or born abroad, even their nakedness thou shalt not uncover. 10 The nakedness of thy son's daughter, or of thy daughter's daughter, even their nakedness thou shalt not uncover: for theirs is thine own nakedness. 11 The nakedness of thy father's wife's daughter, begotten of thy father, she is thy sister, thou shalt not uncover her nakedness. 12 Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of thy father's sister: she is thy father's near kinswoman. 13 Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of thy mother's sister: for she is thy mother's near kinswoman. 14 Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of thy father's brother, thou shalt not approach to his wife: she is thine aunt. 15 Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of thy daughter in law: she is thy son's wife; thou shalt not uncover her nakedness. 16 Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of thy brother's wife: it is thy brother's nakedness. 17 Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of a woman and her daughter, neither shalt thou take her son's daughter, or her daughter's daughter, to uncover her nakedness; for they are her near kinswomen: it is wickedness. 18 Neither shalt thou take a wife to her sister, to vex her, to uncover her nakedness, beside the other in her life time. 19 Also thou shalt not approach unto a woman to uncover her nakedness, as long as she is put apart for her uncleanness. So to what do I owe this God that condemned me so long ago? |
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4 | Studying O.T. is creating problems. | Genesis | itiswritten | 84710 | ||
Dear Free Thinker, You sound so angry. This is not a debate and it is not exactly what you imagine. God loves you and Jesus His Son died for you.I cannot defend God, He is able to defend Himself. I will try to explain better and you do with it what you will. In order for mankind to have a free will...he had to be able to freely choose. Otherwise mankind would be robot-like and God apparently wanted more for us. It is not a matter of good deeds/bad deeds. And in fact our good deeds, even if they outweigh our bad deeds, do not fix our problem. The inherited twisted, sin-loving nature is the problem that we inherited. It is not like well, our Daddy murdered someone and we are taking the blame for his actions. It is a matter of an apple tree only naturally bears apples (unless we unnaturally graft in the bough of a pear tree). So, humans can only be made up of a nature that delights in sin because that is the ingredients we are made of. We still have a free will, but we do not have a remedy for our ingredients. You know, originally Eve fell for the libelous lie of the Devil who accused God of withholding something good from her and if she ate of that which God was withholding, she would be a threat to God and be as knowledgable as He was. (Gen. 3:4-5). Be careful you are not falling for the same kind of lie. God, the Father could have destroyed the initial couple and started all over again but He chose to redeem us all. He redeemed us at a great deal of cost to Himself...His only begotten Son. I don't know if you are a person who is married and has children but if you are or if you have any understanding of the nature of little children, you would know that they are consciously quite innocent even though they may do some really outrageous things. That is what often endears us to them. They love to say "no" to everything we tell them, they lie about the candy with chocolate all over their faces, they take everything in sight and think they are entitled to it all. Yet, all these little antics are wrong...we are twisted, perverted, from the beginning. It is our sin nature appearing as soon as we are able to do independent acts. As soon as we know what sin or evil is, that does not stop us. We actually get worse. This is not because of something an ancestor did. It is our own doing. We can choose not to do these acts, but by the time we can make that choice we find we have already done wrong and even though we make that choice, we can not hold to it perfectly. So, in the end, we are responsible...no longer Adam and Eve. Rom. 3:10-18). And Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth and the light. No one comes to the Father but through Me." (John 14:6)Like it or not, understand it or not, Jesus is it...the one and only remedy. We can choose to take it or leave it because our free will still remains intact. There are answers to all of your questions in the Bible if you would only read it with an open mind and ask the Holy Spirit to open your understanding. In His Word God tells us that we will find Him if we seek Him with our whole heart. If you really want the truth, God will not withhold it from you, but if you like a good argument you will forever be arguing never coming to a place of settled satisfaction. Concerning the episode with Noah getting drunk after the flood. This is just my thoughts and observations because the Bible in NO WAY SAYS what I am about to give you as food for thought but these are my thoughts because I know the Lord and I have pondered this particular question with my personal understanding of my Savior and so these are some of the conclusions that I have come to on this topic in my own mind. I believe that the earth had a different atmosphere before the flood. We can tell from what the Bible tells us that mankind originally was vegetarian and the Bible tells us that mankind also lived a longer life. I believe that the earth had a different atmosphere and that the produce of the ground had more nutrients prior to the flood. And so, after the flood there may have been changes in the atmosphere and changes in the nutrients of the vegetation and so mankind's life was shorter and now it was necessary to eat meat also to obtain enough protien to sustain healthy life. There is no sense that God was upset with Noah for getting drunk, neither is there any sense that Noah did this on purpose. It is quite possible that fermentation was not possible prior to the flood.It may never have rained previoiusly but was watered by a mist (Gen.2:6). We do not come to God by our understanding; we come to Him by faith and He will then give us understanding. He does not condemn us, we will condemn ourselves. Seek Him with your whole heart and you WILL FIND HIM. Sincerely, Itiswritten |
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5 | Studying O.T. is creating problems. | Genesis | FreeThinker | 84713 | ||
My apologies on sounding angry, I guess that it stems from these discussions. One minute a Christian is telling me that I am damned to hell because the bible says, very clearly and in plain language, that if you don’t do this or don’t believe that you are damned to hell. Then I say, well that bible says this too. And then I get the, “That’s not what it meant.” Or the, “So and so was speaking metaphorically.” And I end up not getting a straight answer. I became atheists after years of this type of debate, discussion, or teachings, however you wish to describe it. After finding some many question in the bible and in the way God’s followers act. I still go to church because there are some good lessons about life to be learned. Do until others and be a good Sumerian and the like, but I noticed that the stories of how to keep slaves and kill the unrighteous and the like are never taught. So, in my mind, if that part of the bible is no longer applicable then how’s the rest of it? If God as not been seen in nearly 2000 years, physically speaking or with proof. You may claim that through God’s grace, the Smart girl was returned to her family. Then I must ask, was it for a lack of grace, or a lack of faith that she was taken in the first place? I have the most difficult time believing that all of man fell from grace because of two cavemen not listening. The day that I became an atheist, it felt like the weight of the world was taken off of my shoulders. I realized that I have only failed myself and that I can fix that. I didn’t anger a god that was sitting there waiting to pronounce eternity in hell for my mistakes. The only reason that I am writing to this forum is that I hope that if there is truly a God that cares about us, that he will show himself to me in a way that I will understand. |
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6 | Studying O.T. is creating problems. | Genesis | Morant61 | 84715 | ||
Greetings Free Thinker! May I address two of your points my friend? 1) Slavery: There isn't any verse which says that slavery is a good thing. However, slavery was a reality in the ancient world and even in the not so distant past of our own history. My understanding of the verses dealing with slavery is that they are similar to the ones dealing with divorce. God does not condon either one, but provides guidelines to protect the innocent. God's revelation is oftentimes progressive. I believe that this is the case with slavery. God never condones it, but regulates it to introduce people to later concepts of equality which are made clear in the New Testament. 2) Cavemen: One thing that Scripture is clear on is that we are not condemned because of what Adam and Eve did, we are condemned because of our own sin. Adam and Eve's sin brought many terrible consequences into this world, which you consider unfair. However, you fail to realize that Christ, by dying on the cross, atoned for all sin. Was that fair? God is going to condemn you for your 'mistakes' my friend. You will be condemned (if you are) for your rebellion against God (sin). Even the way you described your relief at becoming an atheist demonstrates that rebellion is the heart of the problem. How about proof? Have you ever personally meet me? Yet, you don't doubt that I exist! Why not? Have you ever physically seen me, even in a photograph? Yet, you don't doubt that I exist! God may not have revealed Himself in the manner or method which you would prefer, but He has revealed Himself in many ways. He reveals Himself in Christ. He reveals Himself in nature. He reveals Himself in the Bible. He reveals Himself in the still small voice which speaks to us. He reveals Himself in answered prayer. He reveals Himself in the Church. He reveals Himself in His people. The problem isn't that God hasn't revealed Himself to you my friend. The problem is that you don't want to accept what He has revealed. You want it your way, not His. I don't say these things to be rude, and I hope that they are taken in that manner. I simply hope and pray that you will take the plunge and submit to Him in His way, not yours. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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7 | Studying O.T. is creating problems. | Genesis | FreeThinker | 84718 | ||
“How about proof? Have you ever personally meet me? Yet, you don't doubt that I exist! Why not? Have you ever physically seen me, even in a photograph? Yet, you don't doubt that I exist! “ To answer this is simply, you are answering my specific questions with specific answers, whether either one of us likes the others writing is beside the point. The other reason that I believe you exist is that I don’t believe that we have created an AI that is good enough to answer my questions. Lastly on this, I have never seen one million dollars either, but I have seen the progression up to it. “God does not ‘condone’ either one, but provides guidelines to protect the innocent.” Exodus 21 does not sound to me like it protects the innocent at all. 1 Now these are the judgments which thou shalt set before them. 2 If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing. 3 If he came in by himself, he shall go out by himself: if he were married, then his wife shall go out with him. 4 If his master have given him a wife, and she have born him sons or daughters; the wife and her children shall be her master's, and he shall go out by himself. 5 And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free: This poor servant/slave love a wife for 6 years and now he must leave her to be free! Kids too!! “I don't say these things to be rude, and I hope that they are taken in that manner.” I don’t, I feel that you believe that you are trying to save my soul, which is very kind. I just don’t see things the same way as you and if god understands me and my type, maybe he will show himself so that we can be saved too. |
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8 | Studying O.T. is creating problems. | Genesis | Morant61 | 84720 | ||
Greetings Free Thinker! Rest assured my friend, I don't think that I can save your soul at all! ;-) Only God can do that! Concerning slavery, you must remember that slaves in every other culture had no rights at all. The passage you quoted is an example of God provding slaves with some rights and rules which slave owners had to obey. Was it as good as ending slavery? No! However, it was a major step in that direction. Consider our own political history. Would someone say that giving women the right to vote was of no value because minorities could not vote? It was a step in the right direction. That is the way I view God's regulations on slavery in the Old Testament. Plus, God no where says that slavery is a good thing. Concerning proof, you make some interesting points, but notice that they are still faith based statements. I could be an AI program. (I'm not! But, for the sake of argument it is a possibility). Yet, you (based on the evidence as you see it) have made certain assumptions. That is all faith is my friend. There will never be 100 percent proof of anything. Everything in life requires a certain amount of faith. Driving a car does! Taking medicine does! Putting money into the stock market really does! :-) From the comments you have made though my friend, I really don't get the impression that proof is what you are really after. You just don't seem to like or agree with what God has said, so you want some other option. However, there aren't any. Well, I work nights, so I have to get to sleep. Hopefully, I'll chat with you later my friend. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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