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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | 2 Cor 4:4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | xmikx | 136883 | ||
Tim, It is so funny to me how your whole basis for "discussing" this verse is the use of god vs. God. Yet, when you (who knows Greek) type, you use both little g and BIG G. Why the difference? Is it to clarify your point as to who you are referring to in your post? This is 1 John 4:14 (NIV) 1 John 4 14And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world. Who is the Father? and why is it capitalized? who is the Son? and why is it capitalized? who is the Savior? and why is it capitalized? In case you are not familiar or can not find your Greek text to interpret these, I will tell you who each is... the Father is God. the Son is Jesus Christ. the Savior is also Jesus Crhist. Your last post contained the following: Scripture also tells us that God loves the world, that God created the world, that God sent His Son to save the world. Is He not also the God of this world that He created, loves, and saves? :-) Scripture does not support the answer you give to the question... "Is He not also the God of this world that He created, loves, and saves?" What book and verse is that from? Please provide scriptural evidence to support this claim. Mike |
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2 | 2 Cor 4:4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | Morant61 | 136939 | ||
Greetings Mike! I am sensing a lot of hostility from you my friend, and I'm not sure why! You asked me to explain why I thought that 'ho theos' in 2 Cor. 4:4 refers to the true God, and not to Satan. I have done this in a polite manner. However, your responses to me seem angry. Why? Allow me to address your points and questions. 1) Capitalization! I use big 'G' for God because I am writing in English, not Greek! :) I also use paragraphs, tabs, and punctuation - none of which are used in the original manuscripts. :-) I don't get your point about 1 John 4:14. I can only assume that you are being sarcastic. But, I have no idea why? I have never said that someone cannot use capitalization when referring to God in English. I simply said that it is a matter of interpretation. So, if you choose to see 'theos' in 2 Cor. 4:4 as a reference to Satan and translate it as 'god', that is your right. But, your choice of 'god' is not evidence, it is an interpretation. In the same way, my choice is not evidence, it is an interpretation since the Greek DOES NOT USE CAPITALIZATION! ;-) Finally, you wrote: "Scripture does not support the answer you give to the question... "Is He not also the God of this world that He created, loves, and saves?" What book and verse is that from? Please provide scriptural evidence to support this claim." Here are the Scriptural references: God created the world - Acts 17:24 says, "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands." God loves the world - John 3:16 says, "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." God saves the world - John 3:17 says, "For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him." By the way, you e-mailed me and claimed that God has never blinded anyone. I responded to you in post # 136177 and you have never responded to that post. Would you please? Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | 2 Cor 4:4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | xmikx | 136952 | ||
I would not say hostility is the right word, agitated might be a better choice. You are no doubt knowledgeable about the Bible. But, from reading your posts, they come across to me as you are better than someone else when their view/post/belief is different than what you believe. This agitates me. This is an open forum. It is open to any and all who want to post, ask questions, give their view on scripture or whatever as long as they follow the guidlines that had to be agreed upon before creating a user name for this website. First off, I have never asked you to explain anything about 'ho theos' as I had never heard that word(s) before until you first used them in your post since I do not know Greek. 1) capitalization, I get your point. More sarcasim from you on the paragrahs, tabs and what not... 1 John 4:14 was used by me to illustrate an example of God and Jesus Christ being referred to by something other than the words God and Jesus Christ. The comment about not having your Greek handy to translate was a little sarcasim from me, my bad!!! But when reading your posts, you like to add in Greek it says _______ 'fill in the blank'. Well, I don't read, speak or understand Greek. But, I know that I do not have to know any Greek to understand the word of God. the Scriptural references you give do not state that God is the God of this world. If you will go back and read your post from which I took this quote, you will notice you were making a point of how since God created the world, God loves the world and God wants to save the world, none of those verses say, "is He not also the God of this world that He created, loves, and saves?" As for you comment about my email to you. I do not have a saved copy of this email, but if I remember correctly, I think I asked WHY would God blind anyone. You provided scripture that answered that question. I do not hold anything personally against you. I just do not agree with how your posts read to me. Your posts seem to portray yourself as better than others when trying to "defend" your point of view. Have a wonderful day fellow heir... Mike |
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4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | kalos | 136968 | ||
You write: "I do not have to know any Greek to understand the word of God." Define "understand". There are different levels of understanding. Grace to you, Kalos |
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5 | 2 Cor 4:4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | xmikx | 136977 | ||
Kalos, This taken directly from my post: Well, I don't read, speak or understand Greek. But, I know that I do not have to know any Greek to understand the word of God. Tim's point has been based on his "understanding" of the Greek language and the reference of 'ho theos' and how many times it has been used and how many times it has meant Jehovah God and how many times it has not meant Jehovah God. Well, I am saying this very clearly, I do not read, speak, or understand (if you were speaking Greek to me, I would not be able to understand you or even recognize you speaking Greek) and I know that I do not have to know any Greek to be able to realize the meaning of a passage of Scripture in the word of God. I have not read anywhere nor ever heard from anyone that I or anyone else for that matter had to know Greek to understand what God's word means. Mike |
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6 | 2 Cor 4:4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | Morant61 | 136980 | ||
Greetings Mike! Have you got a Strong's concordance? Doing word studies is quite easy, even if one does not know Greek. Find a word that you are intested in studying in more depth and look up it's number in Strongs! In this case, I was looking at a word that is used many times in the NT - 'theos' or God. It's Strong's number is 2316. You can find Strong's online as well or in some Bible software. This will make the task much easier. 'Theos' occurs 1343 times according to Strong's! In this case, I wanted to find out how 'ho theos', which is simply the word with the definite article, was used in the New Testament. So, I used my Bible software to search for every occurance of 'ho theos'. Thus, I found that it occurs 243 times. Then, I simply read each verse where it occurs. This is a long example, but there are many such word studies that can be very valuable. Again, I stress my friend that you do not HAVE to know Greek. However, you are placing your trust in someone else to do the translations for you. If they are good translators, you are fine. But, the originals were written in Hebrew, Greek, and some Aramaic. So, it is a great help to get to the place that one can read the originals. Dr. John MacArthur used to say that today is the best time to live if one does not know Greek. There are so many resources available to help one to dig into the original, even without having to learn the language. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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7 | 2 Cor 4:4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | xmikx | 136995 | ||
Tim, Thank you for the information about Strong's concordance. I had never used one before. I went to google and searched and the first one that came up led me to blueletterbible.org I searched using Strong's number 2316 and it indeed is God. I then searched Strong's number 3588 which is the defintie article 'ho' you have mentioned before. 2 Cor 4:4 is not listed on the results page for Strong's number 3588, but is listed on the results page for Strong's number 2316. You might want to check this out. This is from one of your previous posts about this verse: In the process of my interpretation, I have relied on several pieces of evidence. 1) There is no verse in Scripture where Satan is explicitly called a god. 2) The definite article is used in 2 Cor. 4:4. It is a reference to 'ho theos', not just a 'theos'. 3) Scripture is quite clear that while some things are called gods, there are in fact no other gods. 4) God is the only one spoken of as 'blinding' people in Scripture. Using this data, I interpret 2 Cor. 4:4 to be a reference to the only true God You state that the definite article is used in 2 Cor 4:4. But when I used the verse retrieval tool on blueletterbible.org, it uses Strong's number 2316 for god and not the definite article of 'ho theos' Strong's number 3588. Also, have you read Romans 12:2? It is as follows from (NASB): Romans 12 2 And do not (1) be conformed to (2) this world, but be transformed by the (3) renewing of your mind, so that you may (4) prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect. This verse lists the following as the numerical reference for #2 which is 'this world': Matt 13:22; Gal 1:4; 1 John 2:15 Please read these three verses, then please post how YOU can still think Jehovah God is doing the blinding mentioned in 2 Cor 4:4. All three of these verses are very good, but please pay special attention to 1 John 2:15 of NASB. Mike |
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8 | 2 Cor 4:4 | 2 Cor 4:4 | Morant61 | 137015 | ||
Greetings Mike! Blueletterbible is a neat site! :-) I have noticed over the years that most software programs have trouble with the definite article. I think it has something to do with the fact that there are also pronouns, which in certain forms, look just like the definite article. Apparently, Blueletterbible's program is only listing places where the definite article occurs by itself. For instance, in 2 Cor. 4:6, it lists the definite article only once, but the first phrase reads: "Because the God He who says...". The word it is identifying as 3588 is actually a relative pronoun. The definite article (in several forms) actually occurs 10 times in 2 Cor. 4:4. If you click on the link to show the Greek text of 2 Cor. 4:4 you will see: "en ois o theos" The 'o' in the phrase above is the definite article. ************************************* I checked out your verses! Rom. 12:2 Mt. 13:22, and Gal. 1:4 all use a different Greek word than 2 Cor. 4:4 and 1 John 2:15. The former use 'aion', while the latter two use 'kosmos'. As I pointed out to Pcdarcan, there are various meanings for 'kosmos' or 'world'. In John 3:16-17, God is said to love the world. There though, the world refers to the people of the world. In 1 John 2:15, 'world' seems to refer to the lusts and desires of sinful man - see v. 16. None of these verses though use the term 'blinded'. The verses I cited for you before specifically say that God has blinded, or given 'eyes that could not see'. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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