Results 1 - 11 of 11
|
|
|||||
Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | justme | 51188 | ||
I have seen a lot of dialogue about baptism. I want to know this. A lot of protestant churches baptise young children. Does that mean because of baptismal regeneration these young children have had their sins washed away? If so it would seem to me then all they have to do, is some time in their life just acknowledge Christand they are saved? | ||||||
2 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | RAVEN | 51189 | ||
Hello Justme, No this is not scriptual. Young children ages 4-10 maybe a little older have no need of baptism. Because it takes an understanding of what their doing. Raven |
||||||
3 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | justme | 51193 | ||
Raven: Now we have had four children and five grandchildren. Are you trying to tell me a four year old does not know right from wrong? And if a ten year old can shoot a teacher then re think what you have said. AT A PREGNANCY CENTER WE HAVE HAD AN 11 YEAR OLF FATHER A CHILD! I think children are not children as long as they once were. How about the gangs? Do you have any doubt a 7 yeal old could pull a triger and shoot you dead! Oh yes, Raven, they could pluck you feathers real quick. Pun intended, not scarcasim, ok? agape, justme |
||||||
4 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | RAVEN | 51272 | ||
Hello Justme, And that's fine that you feel that way. But you see all those things you pointed out were bad. You have to look futher into the action than just on the surface. Would you dive into water without knowing how deep it was? These things that you point out do not show that the child knows right from wrong. Do you really think with all the TV acting, fighting and shooting that the child really knows what death is? Or was the pregnant child preganant of her choosing, meaning that she knew she could get pregnant? Or was she raped? There is no way a child can understand the scheme of redemption. You cannot honestly believe that if you tell a child that God sent his son Jesus Christ to die for our sins that he is going to understand. All sorts of questions will arise. Who is God? Where is God? Is He dead too? Why did He send His Son to die? Was He a bad son? What is sin? And the list goes on and on and on! Yes, I will accept that there are a few exceptions but for the most part 99 percent of children cannot understand why Jesus paid it all. And even then if they do understand why Jesus died for us theres the act of baptism. Then you have opened up a whole nother can of worms. A child has got to understand why they are being baptized for it to be of any good. Just going through the motions will not help. What did 1 Peter 3:21 say "but the answer of a good conscience toward God". They just as adults have to know what they are doing and why they are doing it for baptism to have any effect on their future salvation. And speaking of future, These children still have to go through their teen years and be rebellious (hopefully not too much if they are raised in a Christian home)but when puberty hits the childs mind changes. And again just as adults the child must be responsible for their actions after they are baptized. You see baptism washes away the sins of a person, so at the point of baptism they are as clean from sin as a new born baby. Romans 6 4Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. But afterwards we must remain faithful Rev 2:10 for 1 John 1:7 makes it clear that salvation and redemption of sins are conditional "7But "IF" we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin." I say this to show that just because a child is baptized, if he knows not what he is doing, there is "NO" once saved always saved in the bible. ALL salvation is conditional. If its in there then prove it by putting it up against 1 John 1:7 or many other "IF'S" I can point out. If it wasn't conditional there would be no warnings not to do this or that or if you do this or if you do that. A child that cannot comprehend what he or she is doing does not need to baptized. That child is in a safe state, and if anything happens to that child God will see to it that it will have a home in Heaven. Raven |
||||||
5 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | Treadway | 51281 | ||
Hello, Raven: Just browsing through the posts and was interested in your statement: "That child is in a safe state, and if anything happens to that child, God will see to it that it will have a home in Heaven." Does this have a Bible reference? If you know it, I'd appreciate the Book and verse. It might take me forever to find it... thanks, Treadway |
||||||
6 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | RAVEN | 51282 | ||
Hello Treadway, I will tell up front that the bible does not have a verse that says the child is in a quote "safe state". But, as from all the scriptures we read mainly the ones Jesus spoke, the implied rule is children, infants what eve you want to call them are not in any danger of being lost. For instance this verse; Matthew 18 3and said, "Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven." If children were bad or stained with sin, this statement would be false, a lie. God wants us to become like little children who are without sin. Of course the childs "safe state" is only temporary, because as the child grows and "understands" right from wrong and can make decisions on its own then and only then can the child start to understand what sin is and why we must be baptized to wash away our sins. This whole safe state revolves around the "age of accountability" which is another term not in the bible. But from reading the bible you must then understand that it was written for the accountable person. So they might know God and turn from sin. I hope this has helped. Raven |
||||||
7 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | Treadway | 51294 | ||
Hello again, Raven: Might be a "split of a hair", but seems to me that Jesus is speaking of a child (children) who believe, have faith, etc., the child who comes to Him in innocence. And is suggesting that is how the believing adult must approach, too. However, there is a lingering question for me, as to the child (or children) who has yet to have the faith of those Jesus speaks of. Or, those that have not had the opportunity, etc. For example, if an earthquake destroyed a city in Japan, and thousands of children were killed, would they be in a "safe state", too?.........Treadway |
||||||
8 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | RAVEN | 51306 | ||
Hello Treadway, You wrote; "Might be a "split of a hair", but seems to me that Jesus is speaking of a child (children) who believe, have faith, etc., the child who comes to Him in innocence." No, there are no spliting of hairs. There are no mention of any children in the bible that were saved or have need of being saved. The children are just children just like the ones we have today, just like the ones being born every minute. Another set verses to exam is Mark 10 Jesus Blesses Little Children (2) 13 Then they brought little children to Him, that He might touch them; but THE DISCIPLES REBUKED THOSE WHO BROUGHT THEM. 14But when Jesus saw it, He was greatly displeased and said to them, "Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them; FOR SUCH IS THE KINGDOM OF GOD. 15Assuredly, I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God as a little child will by no means enter it." 16And He took them up in His arms, laid His hands on them, and blessed them. Notice it says they brought the children and that Jesus did not say as He said to so many others (who were adults) that their sins were forgiven. You also wrote, "For example, if an earthquake destroyed a city in Japan, and thousands of children were killed, would they be in a "safe state", too?" From my previous responce I think I coverd this but the answer would be yes of course they would be in a safe state. Look at it this the way to understand it more clearly. Any child or adult even such as an adult who is mentaly retarded ie. Downs Syndrome. These people can not understand or comprehend what it takes to be saved or lost. I mean babies and little children can't even read. There is no doubt that if an eathquake was to wipe out Japan and every child or mentally retarded person would go to Heaven. No doubt! Surely you can understand this. I hope this has help you to better understand this question? Raven |
||||||
9 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | Treadway | 51310 | ||
Dear Raven: You ask if I can "surely" understand that if a child (or retarded) died unexpectedly, that he or she would go to heaven. I can only say that it is what I would hope. But different scenarios do come to mind. What about those who died prior to Christ's time? I assume they would have gone to heaven? What comes to mind are those who were killed by the Israelites, the destruction of the populations of the cities and killing of the enemies, including the children; or maybe even the ones who perished in the Flood, or in Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding countryside. Would they, too, have gone to heaven? And then there were the children of the "detested" Samaritans, and other various Gentile groups. As for the retarded, I see your point. I just don't know what the Bible actually says on this topic. Plus, add to the mix, the people who died who never had any kind of opportunity to know about God, much less Jesus. Ancient India and China come to mind. Would those people, never mind the children or retarded, have gone to heaven? In other words, is ignorance an excuse? The more I think about this, the more confusing it seems. But I'll keep reading to see if I can find the proper Bible information. Treadway |
||||||
10 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | RAVEN | 51316 | ||
Hello Treadway, Jesus Christ said, "You shall know the truth and the truth will make you free." John 8:32 So we agree that children or retarded people would be required to know. Since they can't then they would be safe. You wrote, "What about those who died prior to Christ's time?" These people were under the Mossaic Law not Christ. But scriptures tell us, Hebrews 11 The Heavenly Hope 13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off were assured of them,[1] embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. You mentioned the ones in the flood. Noah had a 120 years to build the Ark. During this time no doubt he preached and tried to warn. The people probably mocked him. The point is, that others had ample oppourtunity to believe, but the refused. To all your questions about those who may never had heard of God, much less Jesus Christ. Number one God in the Old Testament used prophets and spoke directly to them. The people new God. And the New Testament tell us, Hebrews 1 God's Supreme Revelation Christ the Fullest Revelation of God (1) 1 God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds; 3who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself[1] purged our[2] sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, And lastly, Jesus told His Apostles, Mark 16 15And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. And one more verse I found while searching for this, Matthew 24 13But he who endures to the end shall be saved. 14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come. The bible tells us that the Gospel will be preached in all the world. Even if there could possibly be somewhere that the gospel hasn't reached, that person has got to think "Where did I come from?" "Why am I here?" "What happens to me when I die?" Ignorance is no excuse. Raven |
||||||
11 | Saved with Baptism? | Bible general Archive 1 | Treadway | 51327 | ||
Dear Raven: You say, "Ignorance is no excuse." But it may be a reason, a good reason why many have not heard about Christianity (or been preached to). In reality, most of the people in today's world have never heard of Jesus or Christianity. You may find that difficult to believe but a little investigation will bear this out. And that's just "today". Imagine all of the people in the past who had never heard the WORD. I don't think the answer is as simple as you imply. In the course of history, literally billions of people were not exposed to the teachings of Jesus Christ before the end of their lives. And just asking, "Why am I here, where did I come from, what happens when I die," would not be an adequate replacement. You suggest that all children and retarded people have an automatic place in heaven. That may be true, I don't know. But what's the difference between a child or retarded person, and someone who has never had the opportunity to make a salvation decision? ....Treadway |
||||||