Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | John8:24 and John8:57-58 | Ex 3:14 | sweet | 68949 | ||
John8:21-30 Having trouble with John8:24 "If you do not believe that I am" how does this relate to the Old Testament. The revelation of the Lord God to man? Also in John8:57-58You are not yet fifty old adn you have seen Abraham (58)Most assuredly I Say to you before Abraham was I.I believe Jesus was born beore Abraham. |
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2 | John8:24 and John8:57-58 | Ex 3:14 | DBR | 127129 | ||
¡°THE BEING¡± Ex 3:14 LXX According to John When writing John 8:58, the apostle was not quoting from the Greek Septuagint Version, a translation of the Hebrew Scriptures made by Greek-speaking Jews of Alexandria, Egypt, before the birth of Christ. Let anyone who reads Greek compare John 8:58 in Greek and Exodus 3:14 in the Greek Septuagint, and he will find that the Septuagint reading of Exodus 3:14 does not use the expression Eg¨® eim¨ª for God¡¯s name, when God says to Moses: ¡°I AM hath sent me unto you.¡± The Greek Septuagint uses the expression ho On, which means ¡°The Being,¡± or, ¡°The One who is.¡± This fact is clearly presented to us in Bagster¡¯s translation of the Greek Septuagint, at Exodus 3:14, which reads: ¡°And God spoke to Moses, saying, I am THE BEING (ho On); and he said, Thus shall ye say to the children of Israel, THE BEING (ho On) has sent me to you.¡± According to Charles Thomson¡¯s translation of the Greek Septuagint, Exodus 3:14 reads: ¡°God spoke to Moses saying, I am The I Am (ho On). Moreover he said, Thus shalt thou say to the children of Israel, The I Am (ho On) hath sent me to you.¡± Thus this comparison of the two Greek texts, that of the Septuagint and that of John 8:58, removes all basis for trinitarians to argue that Jesus, in John 8:58, was trying to fit Exodus 3:14 to himself, as if he was Jehovah God. O yes, the Greek expression ho On does occur in the apostle John¡¯s writings. It occurs in the Greek text of John 1:18; 3:13 (AV; Yg), 31; 6:40; 8:47; 12:17; 18:37, but not as a title or name. So in four of those verses it applies, not to Jesus, but to other persons. However, in the Revelation or Apocalypse the apostle John does use the expression ho On as a title or designation five times, namely, in Revelation 1:4, 8; 4:8; 11:17; 16:5. But in all five cases the expression ho On is applied to Jehovah God the Almighty, and not to the Lamb of God, the Word of God. For example, Revelation 1:4, 8 (AV) reads: ¡°John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is (ho on), and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne.¡± ¡°I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is (ho on), and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.¡± Revelation 4:8 applies ho on to the Lord God Almighty on his heavenly throne, and Revelation 5:6, 7 shows that the Lamb of God comes to him later on. Revelation 11:17 applies ho on to the Lord God Almighty when he takes power to rule as King. Revelation 16:5 applies ho ¨n to the Lord God when he acts as Judge. Hence John 8:58 fails the clergy as proof of there being a ¡°triune God,¡± for in that verse, as well translated by Dr. James Moffatt, An American Translation, and others, Jesus was saying merely that he had had a prehuman existence in heaven with his Father and that this prehuman existence began before Abraham was born. DBR |
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3 | John8:24 and John8:57-58 | Ex 3:14 | Emmaus | 127135 | ||
DBR, I hope you noticed this rule regarding posts on the Forum. "Postings must be Biblically based and not opposing to the authority of the Bible, Christianity, or the deity of Jesus Christ." Emmaus |
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4 | John8:24 and John8:57-58 | Ex 3:14 | BradK | 127137 | ||
DBR, You've got to be kidding! John 8:58 is one of the clearest examples in scripture referring to the Diety of Christ. The Jews certainly understood Him because they picked up stones... None of the Greek scholars I'm aware of (Roberston, Vincent, Wuest) nor any of the numerous translators of the many fine translations go with "The Being". Only the Jehovah's Witness as far as I know, wrench such a distorted meaning out of the original:-) My friend, Jesus Christ is Lord and the Eternal Son of God , God in the flesh, and Savior. It is to Him that I look for my salvation! Speaking the Truth in Love, BradK |
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5 | John8:24 and John8:57-58 | Ex 3:14 | DBR | 127143 | ||
Here is what the Septugint says at Ex 3:14, that is said to be from where Jesus quoted from: English translation of the LXX And God spoke to Moses, saying, I am THE BEING; and he said, Thus shall ye say to the children of Israel, THE BEING has sent me to you. Notice the emphisis is on "The Being" not "I am" or God called himself "THE BEING." Thank you for your interest and all who have helped me with my questions. DBR |
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6 | John8:24 and John8:57-58 | Ex 3:14 | Morant61 | 127146 | ||
Greetings DBR! There are a couple of problems with the view that you are advocating. First of all, there is no indication that Jesus is quoting anything in John 8:58, let alone the LXX. Secondly, the LXX is not inspired. It is simply a translation. While it's readings may be helpful in some studies of Hebrew and how it various words were understood at the time of its translation, it is not authoritative in any sense. Finally, the LXX itself does use the phrase 'eyw eimi' prior to 'ho wn'. The translation would be: "I am He who is", not 'I am the being'. But, regardless, the LXX does nothing to the clear meaning of John 8:58. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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7 | John8:24 and John8:57-58 | Ex 3:14 | DBR | 127210 | ||
I agree but then the same can be said about all Bible translations today as they all are copies of copies etc. of the original inspired text that was first penned but no longer exists now. | ||||||