Results 1 - 5 of 5
|
|
|||||
Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | can you lose it? | Heb 6:4 | Glory Bound | 128841 | ||
I beg to differ. Eternal life is not temporary. It is conditional. In a broader sense, what does the Bible as a whole, from cover to cover, state concerning this matter? For every promise God has given, were there not conditions which the recipient must meet? Or do we simply claim the promises and reject the requirements? Claim the love and grace and forget the fact that He is not only a loving God, filled with grace, but a righteous and just God who expects us to obey is commands, and that He WILL administer FINAL judgment? I do not advocate salvation through works, for those who do, do not know scripture. They deceive themselves. What I do advocate is that we are saved by Grace through faith, and that if we have true faith, we WILL adhere to the "whole" WORD of the one in whom our faith lies. And that likewise, those who believe in salvation by Grace through faith should teach as commanded, rather than what they can not prove scripturally, i.e. once saved, always saved. For every scripture one can provide in support of OSAS, any good student of the Bible can provide another opposing it… 1Ti 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: GB |
||||||
2 | can you lose it? | Heb 6:4 | mark d seyler | 128848 | ||
God’s promise to Abraham to give him the promised land was not conditional. God simply gave it to him. My understanding of scripture is that it teaches very plainly that when we come to Christ, He makes us into something new, that we were not before, that is separate from the carnal creature we were, something not subject to the laws of sin and death, something that lives with Him, and continues to live with Him forever. I John 3:9 says that those who are born of God (a past tense action) cannot sin (poieo – commit a single sinful act). There are many scriptures that make similarly plain statements as well, and if there were in fact verses that disagree with these verses, we might as well hang it up. The fact is, any perceived lack of harmony in the scriptures is our own lack of understanding. The teachings of the Bible are in complete harmony if we just understand what it is actually saying. There are many scriptures that make very plain statements assuring those that have been reborn that they will be with God forever. There are a great many scriptures that make statements that have been misinterpreted to say we can be lost after being reborn. I believe many many people who claim Christianity have never actually submitted to the absolute lordship of Jesus Christ, but instead have had an emotional or intellectual experience, and have no idea what they are missing. It was when I understood how completely saved I was that I actually able to begin to enter into that rest that is promised to His children. I have also learned that the only person whom I can actually know whether they are saved or not is me. My duty before God is to teach the whole truth of His Word, and not to shy away from difficult subjects, but to seek His teaching until I understand it. The nature of God’s relationship with His children is one of the more important subjects in His word. This is obviously a subject too involved to discuss on this forum, and as others have pointed out, has been discussed endlessly in the past. I invite any who are interested to email me (see profile) and I will send you the results of my personal study on this matter. I believe that there is only one truth, and that God means for us to know it. Love in Christ, Mark |
||||||
3 | can you lose it? | Heb 6:4 | Glory Bound | 128861 | ||
...if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. This is not saying that the fact that " all things are become new" is immediate. We start as babes and gradually grow. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. Actually what you are, or appear to be stating, is that those who do not perceive scripture as yourself, only "claim Christianity;" That there is more to salvation than what the Lord stated. Dear soul, I am sure you are sincere in your belief. You can get as involved in such discussion as you wish, but I attest that the truth of the Word is not so complicated as to need such "deep discussion," particularly when it comes to salvation; a topic which Jesus himself plainly addressed. Why must man consistently insist on complicating the Word? Surely this was the way of the Pharisees. GB |
||||||
4 | can you lose it? | Heb 6:4 | mark d seyler | 128924 | ||
To clarify one small point, I am not saying that those who do not believe as I do are not actually Christians. I am saying that those who appear to lose salvation were not Christians originally, as taught by John. This is not directed at you or any particular individual, as I said, according to Paul's teaching, me must each look within ourselves to see if the Spirit of Christ lives in us, to know if we are indeed saved. "If we say we have no sin" - the condition of sinfulness. You claim that we are not immediately a new creature, that it only comes over time. Are you saying we are slowly saved, that there is a time when we are “half-saved”? You do not include scriptural foundation for your statements. Verses that say we are re-born as an accomplished fact include: 1Peter 1:3-5 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. 1John 5:10-13 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 2 Corinthians 5:17”Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.” These verses all speak of a past tense action. The Pharisees were just people like the rest of us, who wanted to be the masters over their own lives, while masquerading righteousness. Those who submitted , He saved. I agree with you completely that many have overcomplicated the teachings of God’s Word. It is each of our responsibility that what we believe, and what we teach, is founded entirely on scripture. Love in Christ, Mark |
||||||
5 | can you lose it? | Heb 6:4 | Glory Bound | 129208 | ||
Hi Mark I provided no scriptural foundation because I did not state that “we are slowly saved.” What I did say was “...if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. This is not saying that the fact that " all things are become new" is immediate. We start as babes and gradually grow.” Perhaps it was a little presumptuous on my part to think that you would understand my statement. I took for granted that you knew scripture and would read my words as I wrote them. If you have studied Paul’s teaching you should know what I am saying. What did he say concerning the “renewing of the mind?” For one to think that their life will be changed in the twinkling of an eye is fantasy, and non scriptural. As I stated, when we are reborn, we are, as scripture states “as babies,” and likewise, as babies must grow in the flesh, the babe in Christ must grow in the Word. As babes in the flesh, our initial nourishment comes from milk, which comes from flesh. Eventually a babe of the flesh matures and goes on to meat. Once we have been reborn, as babes in Christ, our initial nourishment comes from what scripture refers to as milk, except this time, rather than being milk of the flesh it is the milk of the word. Gradually we are able to accept the meat of the word. Many Christians never actually get to the point where they are meat eaters concerning the Word. Just like many fleshly babies, they would rather continue on the milk bottle. Eating meat takes effort. Sometimes it's a little hard to swallow. Or else they, as scripture states, surround themselves with false teachers who teach what it is that their itching ears wish to hear. 2 Timothy 2:15 is what I adhere to concerning my spiritual nourishment and teachings. I am not ashamed of what I teach. Many who see and hear my words may disagree or misunderstand what I state. I will try to clarify, but it is not my duty to “make” them understand. If they know scripture they will either understand, research, or shun my teachings. Hopefully though, one day a seed I may have planted will take root. God Bless GB |
||||||