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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Does this mean God is the author of sin? | 2 Sam 12:11 | RWC | 15352 | ||
Does this mean, then, that God is in fact the author of sin? This verse was cited to me in another discussion (Gal 2:17) about this same subject (see the message "Bob: What did you think of my view th... Reformer Joe Fri 08/24/01, 8:57pm"). I have done some preliminary reading from my rather limited library, and have come to no satisfactory answers. What this verse (and verse 12) say litterally, or so it would seem to me, is that God Himself would directly cause sin to take place. Granted, it was in judgement of previous sin. But if two wrongs don't make a right for humans, it certainly wouldn't for a holy God either! How can God do this and still be called holy? |
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2 | Does this mean God is the author of sin? | 2 Sam 12:11 | kalos | 16488 | ||
I have a problem understanding why this thread goes on and on and on. If God is sovereign, does that make Him responsible for evil? No. Scripture says that when God finished His creation, He saw everything and declared it "very good" (Genesis 1:31). Many Scriptures affirm that God is not the author of evil: "God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone" (James 1:13). "God is light, and in Him there is no darkness at all" (1 John 1:5). "God is not the author of confusion" (1 Corinthians 14:33)--and if that is true, He cannot in any way be the author of evil. Occasionally someone will quote Isaiah 45:7 (KJV) and claim it proves God made evil as a part of His creation: "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things". But the New American Standard Bible gives the sense of Isaiah 45:6-7 more clearly: "There is no one besides Me. I am the Lord, and there is no other, the One forming light and creating darkness, causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the Lord who does all these." In other words, God devises calamity as a judgment for the wicked. But in no sense is He the author of evil. Evil originates not from God but from the fallen creature. I agree with John Calvin, who wrote, . . . the Lord had declared that "everything that he had made . . . was exceedingly good" [Gen. 1:31]. Whence, then comes this wickedness to man, that he should fall away from his God? Lest we should think it comes from creation, God had put His stamp of approval on what had come forth from himself. By his own evil intention, then, man corrupted the pure nature he had received from the Lord; and by his fall drew all his posterity with him into destruction. Accordingly, we should contemplate the evident cause of condemnation in the corrupt nature of humanity--which is closer to us--rather than seek a hidden and utterly incomprehensible cause in God's predestination. [Institutes, 3:23:8] It is helpful, I think, to understand that sin is not itself a thing created. Sin is neither substance, being, spirit, nor matter. So it is technically not proper to think of sin as something that was created. Sin is simply a want of moral perfection in a fallen creature. Fallen creatures themselves bear full responsibility for their sin. And all evil in the universe emanates from the sins of fallen creatures. For example, Romans 5:12 says that death entered the world because of sin. Death, pain, disease, stress, exhaustion, calamity, and all the bad things that happen came as a result of the entrance of sin into the universe (see Genesis 3:14-24). All those evil effects of sin continue to work in the world and will be with us as long as sin is. First Corinthians 10:13 promises us that God will not permit a greater trial than we can bear. And James 1:13 tells us that God will not tempt us with evil. God is certainly sovereign over evil. There's a sense in which it is proper even to say that evil is part of His eternal decree. He planned for it. It did not take Him by surprise. It is not an interruption of His eternal plan. He declared the end from the beginning, and He is still working all things for His good pleasure (Isaiah 46:9-10). But God's role with regard to evil is never as its author. He simply permits evil agents to work, then overrules evil for His own wise and holy ends. Ultimately He is able to make all things--including all the fruits of all the evil of all time--work together for a greater good (Romans 8:28). For further study: Jay Adams, The Grand Demonstration (Santa Barbara CA: Eastgate,1991). Grace to You |
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3 | Does this mean God is the author of sin? | 2 Sam 12:11 | RWC | 16606 | ||
Dear kalos, Please accept my humble apologies!! I read this post when you first posted it just over a week ago. I fully intended to reply to it, but never did. I also noticed that you have posted this same message in a few other threads related to this same basic question, but (just going by memory here) I don't recall anyone responding to it significantly in any of those places either. There is very little in what you wrote and quoted here that I would seriously question or take exception with. The problem is that it doesn't seem to answer my question, or, at least, if it does I have failed to see how. I am quite convinced that 1) God is in fact good and that 2) all that He created was good in its original creation. If I may, I'll leave you with two questions that will hopefully clarify what it is that I am asking, both in this particular thread and in the thread which spawned this one (Gal. 2:17). 1. Isaiah 45:6-7 is indeed a fairly easy text to deal with. But how do you understand the passage to which this thread is attached, and (just as importantly) why do you understand it that way? 2. You wrote: "God is certainly sovereign over evil. There's a sense in which it is proper even to say that evil is part of His eternal decree." I am not exactly certain of what you are intending by the use of the words "sovereign" and "decree," but if, as the strongly Calvanist position seems to take, you mean that God has predetermined (ordained, predestined) every detail of history before any of it came to be, than how can He not also be properly called the author (source) of sin? I suppose it would be best if you are going to respond to the second question, that you do so in the thread attached to Gal. 2:17, since that is the question that is asked there and it would be at least somewhat outside of the scope of this particular thread. Again, please accept my apologies. It was not my intent to ignore what you had written. Have a good day. Bob |
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4 | Does this mean God is the author of sin? | 2 Sam 12:11 | kalos | 16649 | ||
Ephesians 1:4 Part 1 RWC: I was delighted to hear from you. Thank you for your interest. Your apology is accepted, although no offense was taken. I was not offended by anything you had done or not done. In this Note I will attempt to answer the questions you have asked in your posts. It is a pleasure to reply to your most courteous and pleasant posting. Preface Let me preface my remarks by saying that I am neither a 5-point Calvinist nor a defender of Calvinism. Nor am I Arminian. When I quote Calvin it is because I regard him as a brilliant theologian who wrote and taught many other things besides the doctrine of election. I simply believe the Bible doctrine of election, supported by many passages of scripture and summed up in Ephesian 1:4 -- "Just as He (God) chose us in Him (Christ) before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before Him." Here is a brief statement of what I believe about election. "Election is the act of God whereby in eternity past He chose those who will be saved. Election . . . does not depend on anything outside of God, such as good works or foreseen faith (Romans 9:16). This doctrine is repeatedly taught in the Bible, and is also demanded by our knowledge of God. . . No sinner can ever make the first move in the salvation process. This is what Jesus meant in John 6:44, when He said, "No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me draws him." . . . Ephesians 1:4-5,11 reads, "Just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before Him. In love He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will . . . also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will" (www.gty.org/IssuesandAnswers/archive/). (For much more detailed information on what I believe the Bible doctrine of election is, use the Search function. You will find that I, kalos, have posted a total of 48 Answers and Notes that include the word "election." I think that anything I ever had to say about election is contained in those 48 postings.) "God is in fact good" RWC: You write, "I am quite convinced that 1) God is in fact good and that 2) all that He created was good in its original creation." I would to God that thou were both almost and altogether persuaded that "3) God cannot in any way be the author of evil. God's role with regard to evil is never as its author." (to be continued) |
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