Subject: What does Scripture say about the Spirit |
Bible Note: Actually I am instinctively quite leery of extra-Biblical sources because many times they become the wisdom of man instead of God - especially when some of the conclusions do not come with readily apparent Scripture citings. I saw a lot of people whose Christian lives seemed to revolve mostly around devotional materials without much actual Bible reading. My reaction was to throw out devotional materials PERIOD and go STRAIGHT to the Bible! I am thankful for that pull I was given. However, since then I've realized that sometimes they do have valuable insights that are not immediately obvious when reading the Bible; on the other hand, often reading these can be like gleaning wheat from chaff, silver from dross. To balance the desire for more insight and reliance on Scripture alone, I usually read the booklets and then seek to confirm/deny what they say by what the Bible says. I wanted to know what justification, if any, there was for what the booklets, (and for that matter the extreme Pentecostalist viewpoint), have to say before tossing them out the window. However, despite having read the entire Bible through, there are always things I don't understand right away. I found it difficult to understand what the Bible had to say on this topic, so that is why I posted. Re: the filling being up to us. I remember the booklet's viewpoint was that filling was something we should pray to God to have happen. Now, that prayer is a whole new thing that put me on edge; it said that if you pray you will be filled with the Spirit immediately, although it may not be obvious. I pray to God almost continually for His will and direction these days, but I have never viewed it as a light switch. The booklet used the interesting justification that, well, it is obviously God's will that we be filled with the Spirit (It did use a verse but I don't have it with me right now), and "if we ask anything according to his will, he hears us." (1 Jn 5:14) I do not fully agree with the argument, because we do not always understand how God wishes to fulfill His will (right away, over time, or in a way we haven't even conceived of yet?) It may even be His will to let us willfully rebel now and then so we may remember how weak we are. And sometimes we must suffer so that we learn to rely on Him. God's will has many objectives for the good of those who believe in Him, not just that one, so God finds ways to fulfill them all. (Maybe this belongs in the predestination thread; I'll go back on topic now) Back to the BIBLE, though! The wording in the Ephesians verse leaves a little wiggle room for interpretation, "Be filled with the Spirit." Be, as in a state that is achieved by continually doing something? (Fill yourself with the spirit) or a passive state (Allow God to fill you with the Spirit)? To confuse the wording even more, here is Lk 1:15: "for he will be great in the sight of the Lord. He is never to take wine or other fermented drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even from birth." At least from birth, the passive sense is probably intended in that one particular verse. Prompted by the responses of both of you (thank you again!) I went and re-studied it again. While I do not remember nearly all the good verses I found, here's what I've been reading from Galatians: Gal 5:16-25 "So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law. The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other." I guess a rational conclusion would be that it is in a way both an active and a passive thing. We should live by the Spirit's direction (v. 16, 18, 25), but the words, commandments, love, etc are the fruit of the Spirit (v. 22, 23) that we cannot get for ourselves (v 18, Ro 8:1-17). Re: Consistency. Yes, two times either I forgot to press the shift key, or once again this keyboard gave out on me. Sorry my typing isn't up to your standards. May God bless you, -- Joren |