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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Age of Miracles - Past or Present | Bible general Archive 2 | EdB | 123127 | ||
Rowdy I see this explanation as one sided not addressing both sides of the issues. For instance it totally ignores the fact that missionaries in some occurrences are given that ability to speak a unknown language understood only by their listeners to tell of Jesus. I would consider that "tongues" Nor does it explain situations like the one I related where a Pastor was preaching in English but heard and understood by a women that could only speak Spanish. There are many documented cases of this. Jack Hayford in his book The Beauty of the Spiritual Language relates a similar story. In your quote there is no room for any of these occurrences. Likewise Prophecy and gifts of Knowledge both are in common usage in the church today. Preaching is probably the greatest example of the gift of prophecy when viewed in the true definition of the words. Have there been abuses of these sign gifts? Absolutely but that does not invalidate them. Incidentally all were commonly used in the early church (first second and third century) so while not recorded in the Bible they are a part of church history. Using the silence issue would be grounds for saying all of the gifts ceased at one point in the Bible or another. As none are mentioned again after their last mention. The discussion on Perfect leaves a lot to be desired and once again hinges on many factors that are man controlled rather than God controlled. Such as the closing of the cannon, interpretation of tense, etc. I have a good friend that is a Greek Orthodox Bishop what speaks Greek from birth that will tell you the explanation of the Greek tenses is not as cut and dried as we sometimes make it. Without failure every discussion we have had on a passage has turned into a thirty minute lesson for me on Greek and all meanings the language imparts by tense and verb usage. I have heard the “perfect” discussion many times from those that oppose the sign gifts today but I have also heard rebuttals given that in my opinion nullify their position. Apparently others agree since there are about equal number of well educated and dedicated men on either side of this issue. If the issue could be proven in either camp then it would no longer be an issue. I contend there is a position that satisfies both positions and it is man’s responsibility to find it, otherwise he views the Bible as in conflict with itself or has to apply “special” meanings to words to make his explanation work. That I think is the biggest problem today we try to explain away things in Bible that seem to conflict with other instead of understanding the Whole Bible. By the way I have that commentary also. It is basically a mainline denomination. There is little or no consideration for the Baptist, Pentecostal, Church of Christ, or Holiness positions in it. EdB |
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2 | Age of Miracles - Past or Present | Bible general Archive 2 | Rowdy | 123131 | ||
I guess you can see from this and the previous posts of mine on this subject, I didn't include examples of tongues as you describe because I don't see the second description in the NT. It seems pretty clear that each time these miraculous powers were used, it was an obvious demonstration of supernatural power, something that was so extraordinary that the news "rang around the world." I would be the last person in the world to put an absolute "no way" on this kind of activity which would be sorta like putting God in a box. But I do want to be a "doubting Thomas" just as the Bible depicts and question these kind of claims of miracles. I'd have to see the evidence myself as so many people honestly and sincerely believe in them with a great amount of niavete. There again, I'm also thankful that this issue, miracles in this modern age or not, is NOT linked to our salvation. I'm thankful our Father only expects us to obey Him and become a christian. I would urge you to keep an open mind and be cautious in this area. God bless you, dear friend and thanks for your response. --Rowdy |
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3 | Age of Miracles - Past or Present | Bible general Archive 2 | EdB | 123134 | ||
Rowdy As for seeing for yourself I think would prove little. Remember the children of Israel passed through the Red Sea and three days later questioned God. I'm totally convinced we either accept God, Salvation and the works of the Holy Spirit by faith or we don't. If a man was raised from the dead before many the arguments would arise, was he really dead, who raised him God or Satan, was this all some kind of trick, was he really raised from the dead or was this a hallucination, are the witnesses credible, was there any before and after proof of his death and resurrection. Remember many of the same people that cried for Jesus’ death were the ones that stood and watched Jesus call forth Lazarus. Now I’m not putting the sign gifts in this same category I’m just saying seeing is not believing. Faith must be exercised. EdB |
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