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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | I liked most of what... | Bible general Archive 1 | There | 12131 | ||
Hi EdB, I too see the Bible as sort of an "instruction manual" from God on how He wants His creation to work. I'm not talking about "works (fruits)" but a general "how to book" in living His law of love toward Himself and man. One of the "how to's" mentioned in the Book concerns keeping the church pure. If a Christian sees another Christian in sin (works of the flesh in the case we were talking about) the bible says: 1Cor. 5:11-13 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone who named a brother, who is a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner -- not even to eat with such a person. For what have I do to with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? But those who are outside God judges. Therefore put away from yourselves that wicked person." Please note that all the sins Paul lists are sins of the flesh. They fulfill fleshly desires, so one cannot set "idolater" aside as something only God can see. We all recognize that money can be someone's idol. And most of us also realize that power, sex, things, prestige, and self also can become like gods to some of us. So if someone sees their brother in sin, Paul says they are to discontinue fellowship with that person. He is talking to the church, not to non-Christians. And in order to recognize if something is sin, we must make a judgment too. Not to judge their heart (condemn them), but a judgment as to right and wrong. Paul also says "Yet do not count him as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother." (1Tim.3:15). Paul does this for a reason. To keep immorality from defiling the church (1Cor 15), and to bring the sinning brother to repentance. Jesus is the one who gives us the order in which we are to deal with brothers who have sinned against us, and it is the proper way to deal with sin in the church also. The man who was committing sexual fornication was to be confronted BY members OF the church most probably using the steps Jesus set forth in Matthew 18. Even though he(the fornicator) was not commiting that sin AGAINST the members that Paul spoke to, they were to admonish that person for his sin. Jesus said in Matt. 18:15-17 "Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. But if he will not hear you, take with you one or two more, that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector." Along with Jesus's words, Paul, Peter, James and John exhort us to admonish one another in a loving manner if we see a brother or sister in sin. The reason is to keep a "little leaven from leavening the whole lump". God didn't intend for His church to follow any thing just because it makes us "feel" spiritual or to make us "look" religious or holy. And accordingly to scripture we are suppose to weed out anything not of God from our midst using the procedure that Jesus set forth. That isn't judging others. That is judging right from wrong. God didn't make us stupid that we could not know the difference between right and wrong. In fact Jesus said "judge righteous judgment" or judge rightly, which means there is definitely SOMETHING we are to judge. Not a person's heart, but whether something is a sin or not would definitely fit in the category of what we are to judge. He didn't want the church -- His church -- polluted with false teachings and practices. God who never changes, of the law which Christ was the fulfillment of, wrote on stone and now writes these things on His children's hearts, "I am the Lord your God... you shall have no other gods before Me... you shall not bow down to them nor serve them..." Worshipping God in the Spirit is one thing. Worshipping Him in the flesh and for the flesh is something entirely different. Paul again states in 1Tim. 5:1 "Do not rebuke an older man, but exhort him as a father, the younger men as brothers, the older women as mothers, the younger as sisters, with all purity." And again in 1Tim. 5:18-22. Paul strives for the purity of Christ's church. And I think James' words complete these sayings. James 5:19-20 "Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins." |
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2 | I liked most of what... | Bible general Archive 1 | EdB | 12177 | ||
I said nothing about sin. Sin is wrong and of course when you see someone in sin it is your duty to point it out to them. What we are talking about is someone doing something that we suspect is nothing more that flesh, unless your 100 percent sure it is flesh you better keep your mouth shut, otherwise you may find yourself opposing God. that is all I'm saying. While in can find not scriptural evidence supporting being "slain in the spirit" neither can I find any that says it is wrong. While I can and do believe it has happened in cases and is authentic, I also believe much that goes on in the church today is nothing but flesh. However God did not make me the fruit inspector. I a person goes down and it is God, Praise God! In like turn if someone goes down and it is nothing more than to be seen, then God will deal with that. If I had a way to tell it was flesh then I would certainly speak to the person but God in his majesty has not seen fit to give me this ability. I have been in church and people have given messages in tongues that I have had confirmed in my spirit to be nothing more than flesh, at that point I spoke up and called it as I saw it. “There’ you apparently do not care for being “slain in the spirit’ and that is fine, I would then suggest you find a church that holds a similar view. But to say it is of Satan when in fact you have no way of determining that puts you in the same position of the Pharisees when they called what the disciples were doing heresy. If you can prove by the Bible that something is heresy then don’t mince words say it. However if it is something that doesn’t go against what the Bible teaches, even though you don’t care for it, don’t call it wrong. Let God judge the motives and let yourself be found righteous. |
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3 | I liked most of what... | Bible general Archive 1 | There | 12217 | ||
Hi EdB, I'm glad to hear that you stand up when it counts. I say that sincerely. As to what you call my pharisetical tendencies, I'm not even sure that I said it WAS of the devil, but I do think it is possible. And apparently you do not think that could even be a possibility by your reaction. And I don't think I necessarily have to prove that the Word speaks against it to recognize that it is not biblical teaching or practice. |
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4 | I liked most of what... | Bible general Archive 1 | glory777 | 12219 | ||
There- I think what we are speaking about is a term. A group of words that people put together to denote an experience that has happened in the bible, but is not called by that term. You do agree that when God manefests Himself, or touches a believer in a special way, they know it right? We do have examples of this in the Bible. Falling was often a part of it - forward or backward, I think that is getting picky, the fact is their strength left them. Whenever you come into contact with the HOly of Holies in an intimate way, can you stand there and not be affected? As far as the possibility of it being from the devil, I can say, from my limited experience (I am from a small church) that I have not seen any proof that it was. I have seen what I think is flesh in some instances. But because of these cases, again I ask, should the whole thing be thrown out? Because some people overeat on food, should we get rid of eating? Even following God can be abused by neglecting family or responsiblity. I don't believe Ed or I have been trying to get you to become Pentecostal. I myself believe that I derive more power from the practices to do the Lord's work and bring me closeer to Him. If someone else doesn't believe this way - so be it. As long as you are growing in the Lord and have given your heart and life to Him. That is the main issue. There are always going to be points that fellow believers do not agree with. We will get the answers when we see Him face to face, and it won't make any difference then, anyway. God's peace. Debbie |
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