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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | One save always saved? | Rev 3:5 | tamrenee | 78768 | ||
I would like to know verses supporting the doctrine that says once a Christian is saved they can not under any circumstances loose their salvation. The doctine commonly called once saved always saved. | ||||||
2 | One save always saved? | Rev 3:5 | Radioman2 | 78797 | ||
Rev. 3:4-5 Does God Have an Eraser? How can I be certain God won't erase my name from the book of life? (All of the following text consists of direct quotations from the work cited at the end.) We will begin . . . by looking first at what the New Testament has to say concerning the book of life. (...) First Printing The apostle John refers to the "book of life" five other times in Revelation. From two of these passages it becomes evident that he certainly did not believe names could be erased: And all who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been WRITTEN FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain. Revelation 13:8, emphasis added. And those who dwell on the earth will wonder, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD. Revelation 17:8, emphasis added. In these passages John informs us about the time when the book of life was filled out. This information comes as a surprise. Without it, our assumption would be that when men or women put their trust in Christ, their names were added at that moment. But that is not the case at all. The book of life has been complete since the foundation of the world. By "world," John does not mean "earth." In both passages "earth" and "world" appear. These are from two different Greek words. The one translated "earth" means just that--this ball of dirt upon which we live. The Greek word translated "world" is kosmos from which we get our English word cosmos. John is using "world" here to refer to the entire universe (see John 1:3; Acts 17:24). In light of the scientific limitations of John's day, it could very well be a reference to all created things. Either way, his point is the same: THE BOOK OF LIFE WAS FILLED OUT BEFORE THE FIRST ENTRY WAS EVER BORN. If that is the case, God's foreknowledge had a great deal to do with who was written in and who was not. In anticipation of Christ's death on man's behalf, God wrote the names of those He knew from eternity past would accept His gracious offer. The apostle Paul had this same idea in mind when he wrote, Just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before Him. (Ephesians 1:4) God wrote before we did anything. He filled out the book of life in anticipation of what He knew we would do. Therefore, He did not write in response to what we ACTUALLY did; rather, He wrote in response to what He KNEW we would actually do. This distinction is very important. For if God put names in the book as history unfolded--as we actually believed ---it could be argued that He erases them as history unfolds as well. But if God entered names according to His foreknowledge, it follows that He would erase them according to His foreknowledge, which makes no sense at all. If God wrote and erased according to foreknowledge, both His writing and His erasing would be complete before the world began. In that case, no one needs to live with the fear that his or her name will be erased from the book of life sometime in the future. But if that is the case, Revelation 3:5 is no longer a problem. Missing Persons There is a second reason these passages eliminate the possibility of names being erased. Both passages indicate that the lost people in these verses had never had their names written in the book of life. John does not say these names were simply not in the book at that time. He says, "Everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world." Who is he talking about here? "All who dwell on the earth." In other words, no lost persons alive at that time had ever had their names in the book of life. Of course, they had never had their names erased from the book, either. The only way around this problem for those who hold to the ERASABLE NAME VIEW is to maintain that all the unsaved people who had their names erased were already dead by this time in history. That is certainly possible, but it is highly unlikely. It is especially unlikely in light of the intense persecution those who name the name of Christ will be facing during this time (see Revelation 13:7). ---------- This material has been adapted from: Eternal Security: Can You Be Sure? by Dr. Charles Stanley (http://www.intouch.org/myintouch/exploring/bible_says/eternal_security/erase_149096.html) |
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3 | How does eternal security build faith? | Rev 3:5 | philemcc | 78817 | ||
Radioman, I agree with everything you have just written, but what does this message convey? If a deacon, pastor, preacher, priest, bishop or pope tells me that I am saved and can not loss my salvation no matter what, where does the Fear of the Lord come in and the need for trust. What is the meaning of this passage in Psalm 107 23 Others went out on the sea in ships; they were merchants on the mighty waters. 24 They saw the works of the LORD , his wonderful deeds in the deep. 25 For he spoke and stirred up a tempest that lifted high the waves. 26 They mounted up to the heavens and went down to the depths; in their peril their courage melted away. 27 They reeled and staggered like drunken men; they were at their wits' end. 28 Then they cried out to the LORD in their trouble, and he brought them out of their distress. 29 He stilled the storm to a whisper; the waves of the sea were hushed. 30 They were glad when it grew calm, and he guided them to their desired haven. 31 Let them give thanks to the LORD for his unfailing love and his wonderful deeds for men. 32 Let them exalt him in the assembly of the people and praise him in the council of the elders. Many of the Saints in the Bible lived through periods of uncertainty in their lives and questioned what God was doing. Rather than, “once saved always saved,” I chose to remember, “I will never leave you or forsake you.” Maybe just another point of view…. philemcc |
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4 | How does eternal security build faith? | Rev 3:5 | disciplerami | 78821 | ||
Dear philemcc, Very good question. Eternal security is counter productive to building faith. I once taught a man who was raised in the American Baptist tradition. The one's I knew from this background considered themselves 4/5 Calvinist'. This man was caught going to strip bars and looking at pornagraphy. He told me that he could not lose his salvation. I know it is so easy for the Calvinist to answer this: he obviously was never saved. But they have to be careful that they don't also exclude themselves from salvation. They diffentiate between sins. The ardent Calvinist who speak on this forum feel extremely secure in their salvation, but they also know they have sin. So how do they come to differentiate between the big and little sins? The 'once saved always saved/first damned, remain damned' crowd have some explaining to do. Disciplerami |
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